Duck call collectors... Go find it!

[William Reinicke]

I was a pubic hair away from owning a Weedys this morning. Got shammed hard. Reported on Ebay and we will see what happens to the seller, but either way, it wont be mine. It is a very obvious call, want someone to get it but at a fair price. It was obvious the guy had no idea what he had as he sells random things. Reminds me of someone who goes to estate sales and then offloads for a profit on ebay. He posted 8 calls, one being a weedy pin oak. Starting bid 99.99, but I noticed he had never sold duck calls before. So I offered $200, he countered at $275. BOOOOMMM!!! I was on cloud 9 and accepted that offer so fast. Then he refunded when he realized the mistake he made. I have notified and reported on ebay, but I want every one to keep their eyes open and see if we can get this call a better home. See pics and conversation below.

Good luck my dudes... I have guys willing to send out some other gems for it if anyone ends up with it. Heck, I might even trade a gem or two or offload a bunch of good RM stuff for it.

 

[Eric Patterson]

That sucks. He isn't an honorable seller. If you list an item you need to honor the sale and not back out because you found additional information after the fact.

Tell me what is going on with Weedy calls. I had never even heard of one until recently. What are they going for and why the craze?

 

[William Reinicke]

So I’m not the best historian. But essentially Mark Weedman was another Arkansas call maker. He made calls close Bowles. Mark weed man then was one of the very first to figure out the turn of acrylic. Instead tho, he was very unique because he was believed to be the first to stack acrylic colors and then turn. So lots and lots of his calls are very crazy colored. This one is actually one of the more boring ones I’ve seen. One of the reasons I thought maybe he was selling at a low price. Also another reason I am posting because weedman call do not go up for sale every day and this one is easy to find again vs his other calls. Most times they are super colorful. A simple google search will show that. Many have made remakes or tribute calls to weedman calls. Believe John Stephens did a cutdown small batch weedman tribute call not too long ago. Over the years, like anything else, they just keep going up in value. Most weedman calls will sell on eBay for ~$600-$900. So as you can imagine, when he countered at a much lower price than this, my money moved over to his account immediately. I think that’s when the seller got suspicious and actually started researching what he was selling. Issue, he had already made the sell to me and then refunded. I’ve made many mistakes like this in my life, but I’m also a person who believes integrity goes further than a dollar. I do understand the position he was in, and I’ve made some dumb dumb sells or trades on my end. Again tho, I’m still friends with a couple of those guys today and we still get a giggle over some of “learning” moments.

Add a quick pic off a google search.

 

[William Reinicke]

What this seller doesn’t understand is we as collectors take a major gamble on these types of sellers. Maybe I get that call at a good price and the insert tab is broken and won’t hold a reed. Now I’m actually out money. So this is what sucks now, is he thinks he is sitting on a gold mine, and he might be, but I’m sure he will turn to a social media to sell at a very high price, and if that call is not genuinely worth that much, he is going to get himself in even more trouble. He wouldn’t even send additional pictures upon request, so he was definitely oblivious to the situation.

I saw a remake osdc call up for sale for ~ $1100. I offered $200 because it was obvious the scroll on the insert was backwards. And it was a 1/50 run that I would of paid a little more for. Many many many do not realize when John Stephens does a remake of an osdc, he purposely puts the scroll work backwards so they do not get mixed up with original early 2000’s calls. The seller pulled the listing, got lots more information and came back and told me I was right. Said someone had sold it to him for $600 and he thought he was turning a quick profit. There’s lots of shady business around duck calls and we all go through those learning moments.

 

[Eric Patterson]

Were you around when someone was making reproduction Beckharts and Stones and selling them as originals for thousands? They were damn nice calls in their own right, but the maker sold them as originals. Might even be some out there in collections that nobody knows are fake because they were that good.

 

[William Reinicke]

Were you around when someone was making reproduction Beckharts and Stones and selling them as originals for thousands? They were damn nice calls in their own right, but the maker sold them as originals. Might even be some out there in collections that nobody knows are fake because they were that good.

I was not, but it was why I offloaded almost all of my JJ Lares in the mid teens because that kid who got ahold of some of Lares machinery was making remake knock offs and selling at a stupid price. It tanked prices on collections, I thought for sure JJ Lares calls would never make a come back from that debacle. One of my regrets today because JJ Lares are in full swing and some are very collectible today. I only kept the ones I would hunt again and some toneboards are just better than others. Ive blown thousands and thousands of calls and sometimes you just get one that is magical. I will give a lot of credit to Brett for how he handled that situation and got to the bottom of what was going on.

 

[Eric Patterson]

Who is Brett? What happened? Sounds like an interesting story...

 

[William Reinicke]

Who is Brett? What happened? Sounds like an interesting story...

Brett was Mr. Lares right hand. Grew up in the shop with Mr. Lares and learned the entire process. Brett is what John Stephens was to Butch. He now owns the company. Based out of Cali. He is the creator of the Mag Hen. JJ Lares was actually a dentist and took a lot of that same machinery and made a shop to make duck calls. JJ lares, at one time, was believed to make the most consistent call. It is why you can buy lares reeds that are cut in 0.05 increments to find the absolute best tune. He also changed how the wedge system goes into the insert and instead of using cork he uses a plastic tab. It is essentially impossible to put the reed in wrong on his inserts. Very cool design.

I am not really 100% sure how this youngster was able to get ahold of some of the machinery but he did and then started remaking Lares calls and selling them as original. Lares does very very seldom wood barrel and acrylic inserts. Usually they are more sought after. You can see it in prices. All of a sudden lots are showing up and Brett put out he wasn't making them. Because the machinery is so good, it was near impossible to figure out what were fakes and what were original. Some said they could figure it out by looking down the barrel when the insert was in the call. Truthfully I could never figure out how to see a fake vs an original. Issue, if someone was selling online, it was impossible to tell. Naturally collectors, including myself, got very leery of Lares calls and of course it tanked prices on all collections during that time. Brett took care of it and I think (don't quote me on this) he got the machinery back and now everything being sold is 100% genuine. Of course the large lip A5's are of the older calls. The A2 are super duper collectible and there is one for sale on ebay right now for $1000. I was offered an A2 for $600 a couple years ago but was literally in the middle of making a deal on all my OSDC's and couldn't swing it at the time.

 

[Rick Pierce]

So I’m not the best historian. But essentially Mark Weedman was another Arkansas call maker. He made calls close Bowles. Mark weed man then was one of the very first to figure out the turn of acrylic. Instead tho, he was very unique because he was believed to be the first to stack acrylic colors and then turn. So lots and lots of his calls are very crazy colored. This one is actually one of the more boring ones I’ve seen. One of the reasons I thought maybe he was selling at a low price. Also another reason I am posting because weedman call do not go up for sale every day and this one is easy to find again vs his other calls. Most times they are super colorful. A simple google search will show that. Many have made remakes or tribute calls to weedman calls. Believe John Stephens did a cutdown small batch weedman tribute call not too long ago. Over the years, like anything else, they just keep going up in value. Most weedman calls will sell on eBay for ~$600-$900. So as you can imagine, when he countered at a much lower price than this, my money moved over to his account immediately. I think that’s when the seller got suspicious and actually started researching what he was selling. Issue, he had already made the sell to me and then refunded. I’ve made many mistakes like this in my life, but I’m also a person who believes integrity goes further than a dollar. I do understand the position he was in, and I’ve made some dumb dumb sells or trades on my end. Again tho, I’m still friends with a couple of those guys today and we still get a giggle over some of “learning” moments.

Add a quick pic off a google search.

Yeah, Weedman's acrylic calls were called "candy stick" calls back in the day. They were so oddball looking, and I can't ever remember seeing anyone buy them. If I remember, I blew a couple as a kid and they weren't very good, so I never took them seriously, but now I wish I'd bought 100 of the damn things.

Weedy's Pin Oak calls.

 

[William Reinicke]

Yeah, Weedman's acrylic calls were called "candy stick" calls back in the day. They were so oddball looking, and I can't ever remember seeing anyone buy them. If I remember, I blew a couple as a kid and they weren't very good, so I never took them seriously, but now I wish I'd bought 100 of the damn things.

Weedy's Pin Oak calls.

Shoulda woulda coulda... I play that freaking game so much around these stupid little whistles. It is what it is and you never truly know which one will become so collectible. What about olt keyholes when they were offloading those for like $5/call? Them suckers go for like 200-300 a call and those are scary buys because you don't know if they have been altered or not. Literally every time a keyhole is purchased you have to gamble that toneboard hasnt been modified. I still have 2 that are original. Got stupid lucky, same kind of thing with this weedys. Seller didn't know what I was talking about when asking for pics, but priced at $60, I took the chance. When I got it in the mail, it was a keyhole.

Found another sweet deal the other day, found a meat hanger echo, DRT echo and two older looking tim grounds all cocobolo calls. Offered $125 and the seller took it. Just got them in the mail two days ago and the insert on the all cocobolo pro mag was hand signed by Tim grounds. Sometimes you win, sometimes you lose. Thats what I think I like most about being a collector of these calls. Plus that all wood pro mag is just cool looking.

 

[Rick Pierce]

I don’t get the Olt thing, but it’s a thing. There are so many people who blow cutdown variations down here now. It’s almost cliche at this point. I have a couple of takeoffs just for the novelty, but I don’t blow them.

And the material of the original keyholes has an effective life, even if the call was never used. They aren’t like modern acrylic calls. Some guys are shelving their true cut down Olts because the material is degrading.

 

[Eric Patterson]

Rick

On public what percentage of hunters blow a J-frame vs. a cut down? Any idea? Yes, Bakelite gets brittle over time and easily cracks or shatters.

 

[William Reinicke]

I don’t get the Olt thing, but it’s a thing. There are so many people who blow cutdown variations down here now. It’s almost cliche at this point. I have a couple of takeoffs just for the novelty, but I don’t blow them.

And the material of the original keyholes has an effective life, even if the call was never used. They aren’t like modern acrylic calls. Some guys are shelving their true cut down Olts because the material is degrading.

Me either. I am to the point in my life too where I refuse to pay market value for calls. I have the ones I hunt and I have the ones I put in rotation but why pay market value when I have so many and I don't even sell or have a plan for them at this point? Like its borderline insane behavior. But I can't let a good or great deal go past me. So when I see one, I gobble it up and I have fun with it. Kind of a weird accomplishment when they finally get to my hands. I guess thats how hoarders feel maybe but my house is immaculate and the only thing I have too many of is duck calls.

When I acquired the keyholes I thought I had a line up on someone to cut them for me. They backed out and they were the only one I wanted to cut one so on the shelf they went and where they will stay forever until someone offers me a trade I cannot refuse or they just disintegrate on their own.

I still do not blow a cut down regularly. I have tried MANY but I just lack versatility on them. I do not and have never hunted actual flooded timber and thats where they seem to be winners. There is a time and place for them, and every so often I reach down in my blind bag and put one on the lanyard. When I feel like I just need a bit more grab on birds out at a distance I will give it a go. There were 2 hunts last year where I pulled it out and it did finally start bringing birds in from a long distance away. These were big water hunts though, not flooded timber. Just needed that extra volume or bark to grab that attention. Lots of times once the birds were within 50, I went right back to my Eason and finished them down into the decoys with it.

I picked up that first run 2B with the purple band on the other forum (had to have a buddy help me out with that since I asked to be banned from there) and it might be the best cutdown I have ever run. It is the first time I ever tried a 2B and the only reason I picked it up was to go with my other first run purple band 1/50 RNT's. Very versatile, doesnt make me purple in the face or make me think I am blowing a goose call to get the notes I want. Certainly has the bark that a cutdown should have and you can get aggressive on it like a cutdown should be blown but it will get soft and ducky on the low end with ease. Doesnt feel like I have to fight it to get those notes out of it. If I have some time, maybe I will make a quick sound file with it and I can post up but it impressed me. I am contemplating picking up another one to hunt or putting the insert in rotation somehow. But the 2B was designed to be a very forgiving cutdown, probably why I like it so much.

 

[William Reinicke]

Rick

On public what percentage of hunters blow a J-frame vs. a cut down? Any idea? Yes, Bakelite gets brittle over time and easily cracks or shatters.

No idea but cutdowns have made a FIERCE comeback and many swear its the only way to go. Where I hunt, I promise you that is not the case. I feel like waterfowl goes through phases. Cutdowns were the thing, then J frames come along and now we are going back to cut downs. Decoys, same thing, when divebomb came out, the mega spreads started. Before Divebomb we were running mega spread full bodies. Sometimes 2 trailers but no one could compete with us because it was so different and so big. My buddy and I are fortunate we make good money and we share this addiction, so we put together a mega spread before anyone else did around here. Once Dive bomb came along and everyone was running 10-20 (sometimes bigger) dozen in a spread, it only took 2ish years before my buddy and i said, lets try 3 dozen and see what happens. All of a sudden that little intimate group on the ground was DEADLY again. I am always trying to pay attention to things like that. What is EVERYONE doing in the game, and how can I be just a little different to try and trick these birds.

 

[Rick Pierce]

Rick

On public what percentage of hunters blow a J-frame vs. a cut down? Any idea? Yes, Bakelite gets brittle over time and easily cracks or shatters.

I don't know for sure, but down here it wouldn't surprise me if it's 50% or more. Cutdowns were kind of a cult thing, and then a couple guys here in Benton made a molded plastic call that is a replica of a cutdown keyhole Olt. To me, that started the resurgence; Kirk McCullough had been cutting down original Olts for years, but then his calls started taking off. Then David? started DJ calls and was making the Olts again with the Olt equipment.

Then RNT came out with the Mondo, and that's pretty much when you knew the cutdowns were mainstream. Every callmaker suddenly had a cutdown style call. And there is now a Cutdown calling contest championship.

 

[Eric Patterson]

I understand the cutdown competitions get more attendance than traditional calling competitions. One of Thomas's best friends is making a name doing it. He works for Rolling Thunder full time. He's a good kid and I hope he can ride the wave to financial success doing it.

 

[Rick Pierce]

Me either. I am to the point in my life too where I refuse to pay market value for calls. I have the ones I hunt and I have the ones I put in rotation but why pay market value when I have so many and I don't even sell or have a plan for them at this point? Like its borderline insane behavior. But I can't let a good or great deal go past me. So when I see one, I gobble it up and I have fun with it. Kind of a weird accomplishment when they finally get to my hands. I guess thats how hoarders feel maybe but my house is immaculate and the only thing I have too many of is duck calls.

When I acquired the keyholes I thought I had a line up on someone to cut them for me. They backed out and they were the only one I wanted to cut one so on the shelf they went and where they will stay forever until someone offers me a trade I cannot refuse or they just disintegrate on their own.

I still do not blow a cut down regularly. I have tried MANY but I just lack versatility on them. I do not and have never hunted actual flooded timber and thats where they seem to be winners. There is a time and place for them, and every so often I reach down in my blind bag and put one on the lanyard. When I feel like I just need a bit more grab on birds out at a distance I will give it a go. There were 2 hunts last year where I pulled it out and it did finally start bringing birds in from a long distance away. These were big water hunts though, not flooded timber. Just needed that extra volume or bark to grab that attention. Lots of times once the birds were within 50, I went right back to my Eason and finished them down into the decoys with it.

I picked up that first run 2B with the purple band on the other forum (had to have a buddy help me out with that since I asked to be banned from there) and it might be the best cutdown I have ever run. It is the first time I ever tried a 2B and the only reason I picked it up was to go with my other first run purple band 1/50 RNT's. Very versatile, doesnt make me purple in the face or make me think I am blowing a goose call to get the notes I want. Certainly has the bark that a cutdown should have and you can get aggressive on it like a cutdown should be blown but it will get soft and ducky on the low end with ease. Doesnt feel like I have to fight it to get those notes out of it. If I have some time, maybe I will make a quick sound file with it and I can post up but it impressed me. I am contemplating picking up another one to hunt or putting the insert in rotation somehow. But the 2B was designed to be a very forgiving cutdown, probably why I like it so much.

I hear ya. I can blow a cutdown, but it seems counter-intuitive because it's just bark, and relatively few notes....probably closer to a live duck, honestly. The volume on one just seems like it would be more prone to flare them, but I also remember some of the big Olt 66's that my Dad used to use on the Mississippi - high volume for open water, but took some lungs to use.

But having said that, when I was a kid, I latched on to an old Ditto call that was in my Dad's call drawer. He hated it up close; said it sounded like two pots and pans banging together. Then one morning he took the boat to hide it away from the blind while I was playing around and warming up. He came back and said, "I will never complain about that call again. From twenty yards away, it sounds like a hen sitting on the water..."

 

[Rick Pierce]

I understand the cutdown competitions get more attendance than traditional calling competitions. One of Thomas's best friends is making a name doing it. He works for Rolling Thunder full time. He's a good kid and I hope he can ride the wave to financial success doing it.

I've never blown one of their calls, but have heard some good things about them.

 

[William Reinicke]

I don't know for sure, but down here it wouldn't surprise me if it's 50% or more. Cutdowns were kind of a cult thing, and then a couple guys here in Benton made a molded plastic call that is a replica of a cutdown keyhole Olt. To me, that started the resurgence; Kirk McCullough had been cutting down original Olts for years, but then his calls started taking off. Then David? started DJ calls and was making the Olts again with the Olt equipment.

Then RNT came out with the Mondo, and that's pretty much when you knew the cutdowns were mainstream. Every callmaker suddenly had a cutdown style call. And there is now a Cutdown calling contest championship.

What about all these companies making a "J-frame" with dagger reeds? Deadshot sells .12 mylar now. I will say the reed in my eason is a .12 but it isnt mylar. No idea what it was, I was sent some from a buddy and he said try this and I fell in love. I only got 5 reeds and had to be very careful which calls I put them in and tuned. Only put one in my eason, and one in a T1 so far. I finally just got him to agree to send me many more with a guarantee I make him some of my skimmers. But I cannot get behind this new trend of a j-frame with dagger reeds. Its like a fake cutdown that tries to do all the things of a J-frame call. Half A** bark with a half A** ability to be as versatile as a j-frame.

 

[William Reinicke]

I've never blown one of their calls, but have heard some good things about them.

Same here, I need to try one soonish. Probably a company I should gather a few of, they are making quite the name for themselves and likely something will blow up and be worth money in 10 years. Just look at their BSOD original. Cannot believe what guys are paying for that call now. But same thing was said about the RNT OSDC's just 15-20 years ago.