who has the most informative vid.dvd or ill book on waterfowl hunting. As decoy spreads for multie species .who where and why's of relation of divers and puddlers and geese. mostly open water marshes.I am looking for the little things that really make the big differnces in a succesful hunt. I dont want a entertainment video I want the in and out and why. also hopefully containing illustration in relation to pockets,bays and open water.I have been hunting waterfowl since the 70's but I am on a quest for something intamate and illastrated.
education
- Thread starter Jim Methe
- Start date
Rutgers
Well-known member
Please forgive me if I misspelled any names here. I think for all around good information, there are two books I'd recommend. The first is successful waterfowling by Zack Taylor. The other is getting the most our of modern waterfowling by Ortier. Duck decoys and how to rig them by Coydendall is a good one too. You should be able to have all of them shipped to your house for less than $25 total if you hit the used book sites.
I'm not aware of any good general how to videos
Another book that is a little more in depth from the biologist point of view is Michigan Waterfowl Management by Dr Miles Pirnie. really give you a better understanding of ducks, their habitat, and what you can do to improve it. Little pricier, but well worth it!
I'm not aware of any good general how to videos
Another book that is a little more in depth from the biologist point of view is Michigan Waterfowl Management by Dr Miles Pirnie. really give you a better understanding of ducks, their habitat, and what you can do to improve it. Little pricier, but well worth it!
I have 2 books by zack now.you see picts of blocks but can your red head mix with scaup? there are many formations . In theory they decoy to thier own specie,so really if you set a "j" do the different divers need to be segregated? I was tought to use the scaup for the tail of the hook but then to have reds at the hook? that to me would look odd. or possibly just a pocket off to the side of the shank.I like to put scaup in the shank and then put them in a lazy "w" at the hook.As to look like feeding birds. Now somewhere in the equasion comes the geese and puddlers. I know that puddlers drop in in the mists of the action divers and geese generally fall short or land to the head. Now for the kicker what is a comfortable spacing between divers and the puddlers and then the geese with all this in mind leaving the pocket open for landing and shooting for all three relating to all three on the water at the same time. Just trying to keep it simple lol.I have not seen too many color picts of this scenerio or working block on film.
Pete McMiller
Well-known member
Jim,
What you are asking is what we all have asked at one time or another. All valid questions but don't get too wrapped up in the minutae of it all. Most times the ducks don't give a rip what types of decoys you have and will land in with other species at will. Take a look at a raft of ducks out on the water (or the pics in the DU Mag) for example and notice how many different kinds are together. Even how many mallards will be mixed in with the cans or BB's.
If something doesn't seem to be working you may 1) be in the wrong spot 2) have the wind wrong for your spot 3) be too visible to the ducks 4) be moving when they are trying to come in 5) or just be out on one of those days when NOTHING is going to work no matter what you do because the ducks have made up their minds that they aren't stopping. As far as specie specific decoys, the only two that I know that are that picky are GE and Old Squaw. Most everything else will decoy to any kind of a wad of decoys.
Recently I was on a trip with three goups of hunters. The most successful of the three used three long lines per layout boat with 20 decoys on each line spaced only about 3-4 feet apart and every other one was a plastic mallard decoy painted flat black. The ducks could care less.
Good luck and remember you will never know all there is to know about ducks and hunting them - that's why it's so much fun.
What you are asking is what we all have asked at one time or another. All valid questions but don't get too wrapped up in the minutae of it all. Most times the ducks don't give a rip what types of decoys you have and will land in with other species at will. Take a look at a raft of ducks out on the water (or the pics in the DU Mag) for example and notice how many different kinds are together. Even how many mallards will be mixed in with the cans or BB's.
If something doesn't seem to be working you may 1) be in the wrong spot 2) have the wind wrong for your spot 3) be too visible to the ducks 4) be moving when they are trying to come in 5) or just be out on one of those days when NOTHING is going to work no matter what you do because the ducks have made up their minds that they aren't stopping. As far as specie specific decoys, the only two that I know that are that picky are GE and Old Squaw. Most everything else will decoy to any kind of a wad of decoys.
Recently I was on a trip with three goups of hunters. The most successful of the three used three long lines per layout boat with 20 decoys on each line spaced only about 3-4 feet apart and every other one was a plastic mallard decoy painted flat black. The ducks could care less.
Good luck and remember you will never know all there is to know about ducks and hunting them - that's why it's so much fun.
Chuck J
Well-known member
I was thinking the same thing Pete. Most guys (even myself) tend to over think these things. When the ducks blow past me, I figure it is #1 or 5. If they work, but won't commit, you need to look at #2-4. Heard the same thing about the eyes being picky...never hunted squaws. The multitude of species of decoys sold are sold to hunters, for hunters. It gives you something interesting to look at between flights. Most of the ducks could care less IMHO Chuck
Keir
Member
Is it ironic that with the DVD's I've picked up, I wouldn't recommend any of them for being educational for decoy work. Some DVD's out there for calling or dog training. Best to look at the book recomendations.
Rutgers: Maybe you should put a video together that fills the gap on decoys. Just send me my commision for the idea!
Cheers!
Rutgers: Maybe you should put a video together that fills the gap on decoys. Just send me my commision for the idea!
Cheers!
Dwight Harley
Well-known member
Jim,
Don't fret about mixing species of ducks in your spread. Divers will decoy to a floating plastic bleach bottle. My spread includes cans, bills, GEs, buffs and lots of coots. I set them up to funnel the birds to me with the wind at my back if possible. Puddlers will also decoy to diver spreads... in fact, late in the season, I have shot mallards over all diver spreads when they are flaring off spreads of all mallard decoys.
Don't fret about mixing species of ducks in your spread. Divers will decoy to a floating plastic bleach bottle. My spread includes cans, bills, GEs, buffs and lots of coots. I set them up to funnel the birds to me with the wind at my back if possible. Puddlers will also decoy to diver spreads... in fact, late in the season, I have shot mallards over all diver spreads when they are flaring off spreads of all mallard decoys.
Lee Harker
Well-known member
Pretty hard to make any alphabet with 12-18 decoys. That's about all I will toss out and want to pick up at the end of the day. Big spreads are great out on open water but when you are shore hunting I think KISS. If you look at birds along the shore, they are spread out all over. I think the ducks are taught pretty quick that big flocks floating close to shore gets you shot at. If birds aren't looking over your spread, toss in a couple more and move them around a bit. A jerk string works wonders too.
Gene Jr.
Well-known member
Jim,
I don't know of anything out there with the info you're looking for. I wish there was. But, you're in luck. In the past both Lou and Carl have posted some good info about setting up spreads and the way ducks respond to surface features. Search back through the old posts and I think you'll find some helpfull info, it helped shape how I put decoys out.
It seems to me that it is intuitive to the guys that are good at it and they don't understand the rest of us don't see it as "clearly" as they do. I've found that many goose field theories can be adapted to diver spread, something to think about.
Good hunting!
Gene
I don't know of anything out there with the info you're looking for. I wish there was. But, you're in luck. In the past both Lou and Carl have posted some good info about setting up spreads and the way ducks respond to surface features. Search back through the old posts and I think you'll find some helpfull info, it helped shape how I put decoys out.
It seems to me that it is intuitive to the guys that are good at it and they don't understand the rest of us don't see it as "clearly" as they do. I've found that many goose field theories can be adapted to diver spread, something to think about.
Good hunting!
Gene
quane
Active member
Hey all,
The Might Layout boys have a good DVD that goes over the basics of layout hunting. It doesn't tell you where to put the decoys etc - more focused on how to setup and use their layout boats. good video.
http://www.mightylayoutboys.com/domino/mlb/MLB_home.nsf
Gene Jr. is right as well -
Lou Tisch is a frequent contributor on this site and is a real bird expert - has some good advice on decoy spreads - for divers. Lock stock and barrel is his business name.
http://www.lockstockbarrell.com/
Carl has some good diagrams as well.
Dave
The Might Layout boys have a good DVD that goes over the basics of layout hunting. It doesn't tell you where to put the decoys etc - more focused on how to setup and use their layout boats. good video.
http://www.mightylayoutboys.com/domino/mlb/MLB_home.nsf
Gene Jr. is right as well -
Lou Tisch is a frequent contributor on this site and is a real bird expert - has some good advice on decoy spreads - for divers. Lock stock and barrel is his business name.
http://www.lockstockbarrell.com/
Carl has some good diagrams as well.
Dave
Gene Jr.
Well-known member
Jim,
It's funny you say about coyote trapping. My stepdad is a very successful trapper and I've learned to adapt his way of thinking to waterfowl as well. Once you think like "they" do, you'll do fine. Food, fresh water, rest, safety...
If you can figure out coyotes, ducks should come along as well. Let us know if you have any revelations.
Gene
It's funny you say about coyote trapping. My stepdad is a very successful trapper and I've learned to adapt his way of thinking to waterfowl as well. Once you think like "they" do, you'll do fine. Food, fresh water, rest, safety...
If you can figure out coyotes, ducks should come along as well. Let us know if you have any revelations.
Gene