Which pattern would you rather hunt with?

Cody Williams

Cody Williams

Well-known member
After many years of hunting with steel and running pretty much everything through a factory Modified choke, this year I chose to switch thing up a bit. I bought a case of Boss copper plated bismuth in a 2 3/4" #3/5 duplex load, and I've been really happy overall with the results but since it behaves very similarly to lead I have been fooling around with different chokes to try to get the best pattern. Which of these 2 do you guys think is a better choice? 95% of my shots are 40 yards and under, with the occasional longer shot at a passing bird.

Modified choke, 40 yards
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Full, also at 40
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Cody

My thought is the Mod looks better. Here's a thought. Put a duck in a dark room and make a box with your test pattern on one side and a light in the box. Then move the box across the duck and see how wide of an area creates three or more "holes." That should show you the winner.
 
Better to shoot at least 3 targets for each choke. This allows you to check for consistency as well as compare overall pattern results.

Given just two to choose from, I agree with Eric. Except I might use a decoy instead of a duck. The duck may not want to sit still for you.
 
It's hard to have too much choke with the Boss Bismuth. It does pattern much like lead, but tends to open up a bit faster since it's only 90-some percent the density. To my eye, your full is the right choke, any bird in that pattern isn't flying away. There are several light regions in the modified, you could put a duck well within the pattern and cripple it. Missing a few but losing fewer cripples is a nice tradeoff.

I tinkered when I first bought some Boss two years ago, Boss ammo through a full choke works great in several different make/model shotguns I own. But you need to have confidence in your equipment, so whatever looks best to your eye is what you should use. If the full looks too tight, you may have a tendency to aim, rather than point the shotgun. Trying not to miss instead of trying to hit. Being a good shotgunner requires you to channel your inner gambler. You toss the shot out there where you think the bird will be, so it requires trust in the gear among other things. I'm pretty sure shotguns hate cautious shooters. ;)
 
If 95% of your shots are under 40 yards, I vote for mod choke.
Question: Why duplex loads? Wouldn't straight #4s or 5s give you more shot per load? MIght close up some of those holes in the patterns.
 
I did the same thing you're doing a bunch of years ago when my dad left me his Beretta 390. I couldn't hit jack with that thing. I tried all the chokes that came with it. I tried all the shims that came with it. Finally I set up targets and tried different loads. What I saw was everything was high and to the left twice as far as your second picture with the blue tape on the left. I wanted something that shoots 3.5" but didn't have the coin for a $1000 gun. I tried a newer Remington but that was in the shop several times until they discontinued it. Then a few years ago I bought a Winchester SXP. This one shots where I point it. Sometimes it is the gun. Or I'm getting lucky in my old age.
 
Ed L. said:
This one shots where I point it. Sometimes it is the gun.
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Cody,
I suspect many shooters, myself included, settle for what ever gun fancies their eye. Then, try to make that gun work for them. As for myself I shoot an over/under better than any other shotgun. Yet I still take a Benelli Vinci to use for geese. Why? I don't shoot it as well as my SKB. Yet I continue to take it and try to "make it work".
There is a reason all top trap shooters are using a gun which is fully adjustable for fit. I used to shoot and place well in competitive archery. I have owned bows which I could never ever shoot consistently. I have owned bows which I had the make a major error, in order to actually miss the bullseye. Good shooting all starts with proper fit. The gun or bow will hit where the shooter points it, but the gun must 1st be pointed where the shooter feels it is pointed. "Feeling where it is pointed" is not the same a "seeing where it is pointed". If that makes any sense.

Not saying this even applies to you and your situation.

Ed's comment just prompted my thoughts. Now back to chokes and patterns.
 
Lots of good advice here....
Dave-I agree that the #1 factor in how well you'll shoot a particular gun depends on how it fits you and how comfortable you are with it. I've shot the same Remington 870 for 20 years now and it feels like a part of me, I'd take that old workhorse over just about anything else because it just feels and fits so right.

Carl-in the late season around here we get a lot of big Canada geese along with big, downy late season mallards, I thought that having the bigger #3s mixed with the #5s for pattern density would be a good do-it-all load over the decoys. Boss recommended that duplex load as a good transition for people coming from growing up only shooting steel, I suppose to build confidence in the smaller shot since I'm too young to have hunted waterfowl with lead. I wouldn't have a problem taking a shot at a 40 yard goose with this load, it's a killer! I also got 2 boxes of 3" 1 1/2oz #2s for our late goose season, that should be a goose hammer! I used one of those to take my swan this year, it was about a 35 yard shot straight up and the only pellets I recovered were stuck under the skin on its back after passing all the way through the breast, breastbone, and body cavity.

I'm leaning towards sticking with the full choke, it seems like it should either be a clean kill or a clean miss depending on how well I'm shooting!
 
Well my eye tells me the better pattern is the one centered on the x but that's just me. I,ve been shooting handloaded 3" x 1 1/8 oz. Bismuth 4,s thru my Beretta 20 this season and have fell in love with a Briley Extended Imp. Mod . Use them on Big geese & ducks. The Bismuth really seems to respond well to that particular choking in 3 of my 20,s. Now shooting steel 3,s in the 20,s i,ll shoot mod. on big ducks.
 
Cody, I switched to BOSS several years ago, after shooting Hevi Steel Bismuth, before it became a steel load. I've tried many chokes, I like a Jeb's choke. Each gun patterns differently. I'd probably run that Full choke in your case.
 
Just my opinion from someone who shoots mostly inside 40 yards. The more I shoot an open choke the better shot I become. Most of my shooting now is at upland birds but pheasants take a lot of killing. That Mod pattern is dense enough that if you miss or wound it won't be the choke's fault. I hate seeing birds blown up by too much choke, seems like and epidemic in hunting videos.
 
If it's any consolation I switched to boss when it was the same price as steel (2020), funny now how much it's gone up. I shoot the 2, 3, 4, 5, and 3/5 duplex. I ALWAYS use a Carlsons cremator LR choke and have noticed a dramatic improvement. Most of my shots are also 40 yards and under
 
I've been shooting Boss for a few years now and went through the same. I love it but, yes, it took a bit of testing with the chokes. My answer: Neither of those chokes. In fact, it looks like you might want the same choke I use. Something in an IM pattern. Right smack between mod and full. The mod pattern is actually not bad at 40. It actually patterns tighter than what mine does. The full is about what I'd expect.

I like either Carlson's or Briley. For comparative purposes. I shoot a Carlson's Bismuth Bone Buster (specifically designed for bismuth loads) in "mid-range" which is spec'd at .025 constriction. Briley Extended Black Oxide choke in "IM" is the exact same constriction as the Carlson's Bone Buster "mid-range" at .025 constriction. The nice thing about Briley is they make the chokes in 0.005" increments and will even custom make a choke for you based on your needs. Super nice folks and very knowledgeable. I am going to be buying one of Briley's light-fulls for my gun shortly because I want something just a bit more tight of a pattern. For my gun, and it varies from platform to platform, this is seemingly how it goes:

Short to mid-range = .025
Mid to long-range = .030-.035
Long-range = .035-.040

A lot of it also depends what you shoot as well. I shoot either 3's (which are absolute hammers) for geese, 5's all around for puddle ducks, and I will switch to 4's all around once my 5's are depleted. I personally like the 4's for coastal. Craig recommended this to me and they cut the wind better and take down bigger birds like our black ducks more efficiently.

Give an "IM" choke a try. For me it's been a perfect mid-longer range choke.
 
I have shot and patterned over a dozen different shotguns in 3 different gauges(12, 20, 28) with BOSS. Every one has patterned better with a choke tighter than modified. Some better with Improved Modified, some better with Full, and even some better with XFull. Honestly havent noticed much, if any difference, between factory or aftermarket chokes.
 
Question for BOSS shooters.

BOSS gets a ton of praise and I have been shooting it too. But I read something alarming about it a couple months back on a vintage shotgun group. One member reported getting terrible patterns from it, I mean like unprecedented bad patterns. As he investigated the cause he discovered the copper plating was delaminating from the pellets causing little "wings" over the surface of the pellet, wrecking its performance. Has anyone else heard of this? An isolated event or has BOSS run into a manufacturing issue that compromises its quality?
 
Eric Patterson said:
Question for BOSS shooters.

BOSS gets a ton of praise and I have been shooting it too. But I read something alarming about it a couple months back on a vintage shotgun group. One member reported getting terrible patterns from it, I mean like unprecedented bad patterns. As he investigated the cause he discovered the copper plating was delaminating from the pellets causing little "wings" over the surface of the pellet, wrecking its performance. Has anyone else heard of this? An isolated event or has BOSS run into a manufacturing issue that compromises its quality?
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Interesting question. I cut open a couple of shells, I have #4's and #7's in my hand. I crushed a couple, I don't see the "plating" delaminating. I'm not sure what the copper coating is, plating or paint. I need to study it under a magnifying glass. On lead pellets, from years ago until present, so-called plating is almost always a paint or coating, not true metallic plating. So it doesn't flake or delaminate.

I'm curious if the writer was looking at pellets from a shell he cut open, or picked up downrange? If it's the latter I question whether the damage was caused by his barrel, or impact. Pellets in early bismuth loads c.1990 had a habit of being pulverized so you would see significant sand/dust size particles hit the water. If true that the pellets are deformed or damaged, hopefully Boss addresses the problem. Quickly, before I buy another batch. :)
 
Eric Patterson said:
Question for BOSS shooters.

BOSS gets a ton of praise and I have been shooting it too. But I read something alarming about it a couple months back on a vintage shotgun group. One member reported getting terrible patterns from it, I mean like unprecedented bad patterns. As he investigated the cause he discovered the copper plating was delaminating from the pellets causing little "wings" over the surface of the pellet, wrecking its performance. Has anyone else heard of this? An isolated event or has BOSS run into a manufacturing issue that compromises its quality?
Click to expand...
My understanding is the fragmenting is/was the biggest issue with BOSS and bismuth in general. From my limited research BOSS has addressed this in 2023 with their new War Chief line. The older line is called Legacy now.
 
The copper coating is such a thin wash I doubt it does anything except make the shot pretty, unless they have some new way of coating it now.
I'd have a hard time believing that they can make it fragment less without making it lighter. I like the stuff but it has its cons.
 
I may have asserted "plating" going from memory. I tried to find the original post but no luck. Plated, painted, or coated, he definitely reported it flaking off. I'll keep searching. It sounded legit when I read it.
 
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