Rail Skiff Build

jode hillman said:
Looks great! For rail work I like the traditional 3 prong push pole head. Different than the herters head I use for mud work on the duck rig. The 3 prong head grips vegetation better, and that in turn acts as the bearing surface for pushing.

Here is a pic of a 16' 100 year old tapered pole recently given to me by a friend.

White oak inlet foot, copper riveted to Doug Fir or spruce.
Click to expand...
That's pretty cool! A 100 year old pole, bet it has stories to tell.

I like the 3 prong head as well. I wish Stiffy offered a 15-16' pole and a bigger foot, both of which I want. The 14 is a bit short, the 18 maybe a touch long. My dilemma is wanting a pole that's as light as possible for the old coot, and reduce the possibility of a break and being harpooned. The composite poles are just so much lighter, and less likely to snap.
 
Last night the boat interior was sanded, then a coat of resin applied. A layer of tape is on the floor scarf joint, I feel more secure with that. Putting a foot through the bottom is no good.20250717_184335.jpg

There are still a few interior features required such as the breasthook and a vertical trim piece under it. Notably, a proper rail boat has a poling platform. This photo shows the platform frame roughed out. Another support will be added along the stern, and most likely a vertical support to the keelson at the forward timber. Everything is prefit and clamped before any screws or glue. No screws are going to penetrate the hull for the platform, if it fails I don't want pull-through holes. Lots of thickened epoxy should do the trick together with screws at the top and bottom of the support knee, cedar to cedar. I should mention that #10 wood screws hold well in this Western Red Cedar, #8's were not awe inspiring.

20250717_184137.jpg
 
SJ Fairbank said:
More progress...

Scarfed and glued the 3/8" for the sides on Tuesday. The scarf joint is 4", so a roughly 10/1 scarf. The 1/2" is also 4" so 8/1. Note the high tech custom clamping system, complete with about 50 pounds of sand and lead in each bucket. Scarfing is the most tedious part of boat building for me, and the one I'm least proficient at. The power planer did help, with a sander and hand planer you wonder if you'll ever get done. With a power planer you have to be careful not to let it become too aggressive. It worked best at the minimum cut setting. Finished off the scarf with the belt sander. I give this one a grade of B, and that might be generous. I'll be glueing the 1/2" floor tonight. The painters plastic works well to prevent unwanted adhesion, it doesn't stick to the epoxy (or vice versa) at all.
View attachment 66956

I usually make a pattern to cut the sides, rather than wrestle with a half sheet of plywood. This Builders Board is good stuff. My one caution is to make a good pattern, but leave the plywood a bit proud until after final fitting on the boat. I did this at lunch today, half an hour and done.

View attachment 66957View attachment 66958

The same pattern fit both sides (mirror image). I left a solid 1-1/2" all around when cutting to avoid a major oh shit. I cut the two sides last night, clamped, drilled and temporarily fastened them for final scribing. In some builds, I've had luck using a router with a panel cutting bit to clean up the edges, tried it on here and epic fail. It doesn't like the angle of the side. I'll take them off later today, use the jigsaw to carefully cut along the scribe lines. I'm also going to run the sander across the scarf a little, it's got a very minor bulge that I think will come right out.

View attachment 66959

That all looks like a Kindergarten class worked on it. :) The sides will be affixed with 1-1/4", #8 wood screws and a liberal slather of epoxy. This last view from above gives the sense of the lines. Narrow and pointy.

View attachment 66960
Click to expand...
SJ~

Congratulations on a fine build - and a gorgeous vessel!

One question: Did you consider using bronze boat nails instead of screws for the sides and bottom? I prefer them for fastening "sheet goods" because they require no countersinking - thus less weakening of the plywood and risk of "pull-through" from flathead screws. Because the metal is so soft, they conform to any finish sanding, too.

I do not know how they would grip in your fine Western Red Cedar. In any event, you can find them on the Top Shelf - right next to the WRC , Hummingbird Tongues and other Bespoke Materials & Supplies.....

All the best,

SJS
 
Steve,

I like bronze nails, years ago I got them from Jamestown Distributors in RI. They used to have a store where I could pick them up, now it's shipping only. I like to see them when I buy. :) Plus if I run short I have to wait for the mailman, I'm hooked on give it to me now. So this boat ended up with screws primarily because I could source them easily.

Before the decision to use screws, I pondered using nails. In retrospect, I believe that some would have pulled out, as this cedar is pretty soft. Seeing the #8 screws strip was an eye opener. I'm also relieved that I didn't have to find out if the 5/4 cedar would have cracked due to nailing. This WRC is wonderful to work with however, quite pliable, planes easily and it smells good while it gives you a headache.
 
SJ Fairbank said:
Steve,

I like bronze nails, years ago I got them from Jamestown Distributors in RI. They used to have a store where I could pick them up, now it's shipping only. I like to see them when I buy. :) Plus if I run short I have to wait for the mailman, I'm hooked on give it to me now. So this boat ended up with screws primarily because I could source them easily.

Before the decision to use screws, I pondered using nails. In retrospect, I believe that some would have pulled out, as this cedar is pretty soft. Seeing the #8 screws strip was an eye opener. I'm also relieved that I didn't have to find out if the 5/4 cedar would have cracked due to nailing. This WRC is wonderful to work with however, quite pliable, planes easily and it smells good while it gives you a headache.
Click to expand...
SJ~

I never thought of splitting - but I did wonder how well they might hold in your Cedar. They grip impressively in the Oak, Mahogany, Douglasfir and Cypress that I have used. But, I also understand your desire for ease of acquisition. Living where I do now, everything "boat" comes via UPS etc. Jamestown Distributors - and Hamilton Marine - remain trusted suppliers. I was on Long Island when I built my first gunning boats. Kirkup's Lumber in Bayshore - a few miles from my house - catered to boatbuilders. In addition to all the right woods, they kept their Anchorfast bronze boat nails in open bins - to be weighed and purchased by the pound. I brought them home loose in paper bags....

Another digression: I helped my Dad build floorboards of Western Red Cedar for a grassboat long ago - but have not used WRC on boats since (1960s). However, a friend gave me some big chunks and I have made many bases for carvings with it. The aroma, the grain, and ease of shaping and sanding are wonderful. (The Killdeer is White Pine - but the base is WRC.)

sm WS Killdeer 2014 - Dill.jpg

All the best!

SJS
 
Steve Sanford said:
SJ~

I never thought of splitting - but I did wonder how well they might hold in your Cedar. They grip impressively in the Oak, Mahogany, Douglasfir and Cypress that I have used. But, I also understand your desire for ease of acquisition. Living where I do now, everything "boat" comes via UPS etc. Jamestown Distributors - and Hamilton Marine - remain trusted suppliers. I was on Long Island when I built my first gunning boats. Kirkup's Lumber in Bayshore - a few miles from my house - catered to boatbuilders. In addition to all the right woods, they kept their Anchorfast bronze boat nails in open bins - to be weighed and purchased by the pound. I brought them home loose in paper bags....

Another digression: I helped my Dad build floorboards of Western Red Cedar for a grassboat long ago - but have not used WRC on boats since (1960s). However, a friend gave me some big chunks and I have made many bases for carvings with it. The aroma, the grain, and ease of shaping and sanding are wonderful. (The Killdeer is White Pine - but the base is WRC.)

View attachment 67130

All the best!

SJS
Click to expand...
You hit the nail on the head ;) , quality nails from a known supplier are a must. Not all bronze boat nails are created equal, I bought a bubble pack from a big box marine supplier once that had microscopic rounded rings. Very poor manufacture for the intended use. In any event, I'm glad screws were chosen, as the WRC is quite soft. There are numerous dings needing repair just from flipping the boat on edge and where it lay on the strongback. I'm quite certain there would be hammer marks everywhere if it was nailed. I'm guessing splits too, but I'm not sure.

I like to see the Killdeer. My dad loved making shorebirds. His favorite base, when available to him, was driftwood. "Available to him" means what he picked up along the lakeshore at camp in Maine. :D
 
So we're coming down the home stretch with construction. Not to ignore sanding and painting, but once the last piece of wood is attached or ready to be pending paint, I'm feeling good. This weekend the poling platform was made permanent, one screw from the knee into the chine, then epoxy to the side and at all joints. As mentioned earlier in the build, all screws are #10, as my usual #8's failed. The horizontal timber is 5/4 x 3 1/2" WRC. Not having used it for a raised deck before I'm a little nervous but it seems pretty solid and the weight will be distributed across three load bearing members. I'm still considering a vertical support from the keelson to the front timber, but am still on the fence. I have time as the deck won't be made permanent until after painting.

A view from the bow, the blemish in the middle of the timber is my brand. Everything is coated in two or more coats of epoxy, which should be adequate protection without paint. I'll leave the brand clear so it's legible, because I like it, and in case someone covets the boat.

20250720_104319.jpg

The next two depict the rough fit deck, 3/4" x 7 1/4" Philippine Mahogany. I rounded the edges and set them with a 1/4" gap to allow water to pass and permit the wood to work just in case. If it appears that the rounding is overdone, it's because I might pole barefoot on a hot day. And you never know when the boat might get a little bluecrab action on a hot summer day/night.

20250720_104415.jpg20250720_104319.jpg

The last necessary pieces are the bow trim, I'll work on them tonight. Guess I need to order paint.
 
Jeff Reardon said:
Just curious, why WRC for the poling platform but mahogany for the deck? No matter what you used--looking great!
Click to expand...
It's what I have on hand. Notice the keelson is also mahogany. I'd rather pay taxes than visit the lumber yard again for this boat. Hopefully the 5/4" cedar is thick enough to take the load, I think the 3/4" mahogany (meranti) is plenty tough enough to stand on. What I dislike about the mahogany is the oils, epoxy bonds ok but it absolutely refuses to bond well with polyester. Paint tends to bubble long term, depending on the specific piece of wood. I'm triple coating the mahogany with epoxy before painting.
 
Looking great SJ. You are going to have a lot of fun with this boat. One thing, and you probably have it covered-but I am the pushee and not the pusher on these boats, and don't forget the piece for the pushee in the front to put his/her toe under when standing:)
 
greg setter said:
Looking great SJ. You are going to have a lot of fun with this boat. One thing, and you probably have it covered-but I am the pushee and not the pusher on these boats, and don't forget the piece for the pushee in the front to put his/her toe under when standing:)
Click to expand...
Thank you. I hope it works as well as I....hope...it will. This is the first rail skiff I've built by taking measurements off another boat. The others were winging it. It's getting a little heavy, I should have shortened the sides. Glorious hindsight.

On the subject of standing, I prefer a barstool that the shooter primarily remains seated upon. The stool is attached to a removable, sliding wide frame for more stability, and to permit fore/aft travel to trim the boat for minimum draft. Less chance of a swim or a firearm waving in the breeze while unbalanced. The stool will be the last piece built, kind of a surprise ending.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top