devlin cackler

H

Hess Robertson

New member
I introduced my self on here several weeks ago, and stated that I would soon be starting a Devlin Cackler build. I've been collecting tools and finally got the courage up to order plywood(~$100 sheets of plywood make you think twice). I've got a couple or questions:

1.) How accurate is the materials list that comes with the plans (mostly concerning the epoxy (15 gallons seems like a lot), fiberglass cloth, and tape)?
2.) Do most people epoxy/glass the interior or their boats? If so, is this material included in the materials list on the plans?
3.) Should I buy bi-axial tape or make my own tape stripping full cloth fiberglass?
4.) I'm planning to have a traditional transom; not the transom with the motor well from the original design. How thick should my transom be? What angle should it be (from the reading I've done on here it looks like it should be 15-17 degrees)?

I have many more questions. I will save them for later. This should be a good start (don't want to get to overwhelmed). This site is going to be a great resource.

Thanks,
Hess Robertson
 
One more questions I forgot to ask:

How many layers of fiberglass cloth are folks typically putting on the bottom side of the hull?
 
I introduced my self on here several weeks ago, and stated that I would soon be starting a Devlin Cackler build. I've been collecting tools and finally got the courage up to order plywood(~$100 sheets of plywood make you think twice). I've got a couple or questions:

1.) How accurate is the materials list that comes with the plans (mostly concerning the epoxy (15 gallons seems like a lot), fiberglass cloth, and tape)?
2.) Do most people epoxy/glass the interior or their boats? If so, is this material included in the materials list on the plans?
3.) Should I buy bi-axial tape or make my own tape stripping full cloth fiberglass?
4.) I'm planning to have a traditional transom; not the transom with the motor well from the original design. How thick should my transom be? What angle should it be (from the reading I've done on here it looks like it should be 15-17 degrees)?

I have many more questions. I will save them for later. This should be a good start (don't want to get to overwhelmed). This site is going to be a great resource.

Thanks,
Hess Robertson
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1) As a first time builder it is likely you will use more epoxy than listed, but 15 gallons does seem like a lot. As far as cloth and tape they seem good - no one complains.

2) most do not glass the inside of the boat. I did not, but would put a light layer on just the sole to do it again. Inside glass is not in the plans.

3) I would buy tape, myself. Biax can be such a pain that for someone inexperianced with it just picking it up can mess it up.

4) there is no reason the transom would would need to be more than 1 1/2 " thick. A single layer of 3/4" ply would probably be fine, but I'd do 1 1/2".
 
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One more questions I forgot to ask:

How many layers of fiberglass cloth are folks typically putting on the bottom side of the hull?
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If in non-rocky areas one layer is fine (doubled at the joints, though).
 
If it were me I would buy three gal. to start and go from there unless there is a good discount for 5 gals. Good luck with your project.
 
I did not use glass cloth on the interior of my Broadbill, however, I did coat it with two coats of epoxy.
It is about 9 years ago since I built it, and I have just noticed a few hairline cracks on the flat areas of the interior. The exterior (glass cloth covered) is still in good shape.

Good luck with your build!

Best,
Brian F.
 
Hess ,

Built a Cackler 6 years ago with the traditional transom ( No motor well ) love the boat works great for chasing stripers and ducks , as far as materials go , the epoxy is expensive but the 15 gallons is off a little ,i think i used about 8 or 9 if i recall, i used System 3 and was very happy with it but the prices have gone through the roof on it , some guys use Us Composites epoxy maybe someone can chime in with more epoxy info , As far as wood you will end up using pretty much all the wood to plan , glass , i covered the bottom of my boat to 8 inches up the side with 2 layers of 6 oz e-glass , we have alot of ice here in New england during the season , and glassed the inside as well , i also installed a keelson the full length inside and galssed that in as well , the floor does not come out wich adds to the rigidity of the boat . As far as Biaxial tape i got a little crazy with this and used 2 layers of 17 oz biaxial tape , after i filleted my corners i put a 4 inch wide strip and then went with a 6 inch piece so i basically have 34 oz's of tape in every corner of the boat, yes it is over kill maybe one layer of 17 oz would be good enough . Biggest thing i can suggest is to build it as best as you can using the best you can afford and do not cut corners , i have had mine for 6 years and use it year round for fishing and hunting . And Rememebr you are in the best spot on the web for tips and input these guys here are the best at walking people through so just ask away and do not hesitate to give me a call if you have questions , i do have pics but i have to get them together and i will post as soon as i can . Good Luck !! and Enjoy it will be the best time you ever spend


Dave M
401-215-5062
 
Morton,
I am goin to come on over to get a bowl of chowder and bring my scanner. Then we are going to scan all the pictures and you wont be able to say that about them.
I am going to bring the knife and the wood too. Might even be a test Brant in the mix to practice around!


Just as soon as my wife lets me!


Butler
 
Thanks for all the replies. Definitely going to glass the interior. I think I will order RAKA's 6 gallon kit of epoxy with hardner to get started. I know this is going to sound weird, but I think I will probably enjoy the building process more than actually using the boat. I just like having a project around to work on in my free time. Most people in this world would think that working on a "project" would not be enjoyable, but I doubt that is the case with the folks on this site. I'm not sure how long it will take me to complete the project; I don't have tons of spare time (I'm a medical resident). But the work stretched over a good amount of time, will allow me to really plan out exactly what I want to do and how to do it. My dad, who taught carpentry and industrial arts for 30 years, is going to be in town in 2 weeks to help me get started; we will see how much of his knowledge translates into boat building. I also have a good friend that is building a drift boat for trout fishing some of the local streams here in Arkansas who is going to lend a hand. I will have to learn how to post pics on here once I get started to show my progress and so y'all can give me ideas/suggestions.

Mr. Dave,
I hope you get around to gathering up your pics and loading them to your computer. From what I've read on here, you have done a lot of the mods I was thinking about doing.

Another question:
I know I'm a long way off from this point, but I've just been wondering about it so I'll ask. I know a lot of the guys on here stand up when the boat is under way even with a tiller motor. I have been around boats (skiffs to center consoles to bay boats to shrimp boats). The only time I have ever stood up while driving a boat is shrimping or running a center console in rough water. My plans from Mr. Devlin don't really have any type of seating. What types of seating arrangements work well in this boat?
 
Thanks for all the replies. Definitely going to glass the interior. I think I will order RAKA's 6 gallon kit of epoxy with hardner to get started. I know this is going to sound weird, but I think I will probably enjoy the building process more than actually using the boat. I just like having a project around to work on in my free time. Most people in this world would think that working on a "project" would not be enjoyable, but I doubt that is the case with the folks on this site. I'm not sure how long it will take me to complete the project; I don't have tons of spare time (I'm a medical resident). But the work stretched over a good amount of time, will allow me to really plan out exactly what I want to do and how to do it. My dad, who taught carpentry and industrial arts for 30 years, is going to be in town in 2 weeks to help me get started; we will see how much of his knowledge translates into boat building. I also have a good friend that is building a drift boat for trout fishing some of the local streams here in Arkansas who is going to lend a hand. I will have to learn how to post pics on here once I get started to show my progress and so y'all can give me ideas/suggestions.

Mr. Dave,
I hope you get around to gathering up your pics and loading them to your computer. From what I've read on here, you have done a lot of the mods I was thinking about doing.

Another question:
I know I'm a long way off from this point, but I've just been wondering about it so I'll ask. I know a lot of the guys on here stand up when the boat is under way even with a tiller motor. I have been around boats (skiffs to center consoles to bay boats to shrimp boats). The only time I have ever stood up while driving a boat is shrimping or running a center console in rough water. My plans from Mr. Devlin don't really have any type of seating. What types of seating arrangements work well in this boat?
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The build is great fun, especially the modifications. The nice thing is that stitch and glue is very forgiving. If you loft and cut all your hull pieces so they are good (which sets you up for a true hull), you really can cover up or hide any other lacking craftmanship.

You are right to think about the mods now - too many folks spend a bunch of time building a hand made boat and when it is done it is as plain jane as a jon boat. Think about where you are going to hide your wires, so they aren't surface mounted, access to parts of the boat that are hidden, storage, etc...

People have all sorts of seating arraingments, some good, some clunky. Many if not most don't plan for it during the build and end up using something makeshift. I added a shelf to the front of the splashwell that I sit on. As I get older I wish it was wider :).

I always drive standing, unless it the conditions are bad or I'm making a long run through simple water. I would not drive the smaller Devlin boats standing without a support of some sort, but on the snowgoose or cackler I'm comfortable with it.

If you are going to go with a conventional transom, put a motor well on it similar to a snowgoose.

A final suggestion for a biax user (the smaller boats don't use biax on the fillets)... buy a few yards of peel ply. If you don't know what it is, peel ply is a woven fabric that does an amazing job in helping you create quality and clean laminates for your fillets. You put it on top of your biax after you have it wetted out adn squeegee it smooth, this removes excess epoxy (gives youa better glass to resin and strength to weight ratio) and fairs the joint in nicely (which is the real benefit). You rip it off the fillet when done and it leaves a real nice surface. Not enough people use it.
 
Mr. Todd, "A final suggestion for a biax user (the smaller boats don't use biax on the fillets)... buy a few yards of peel ply. If you don't know what it is, peel ply is a woven fabric that does an amazing job in helping you create quality and clean laminates for your fillets. You put it on top of your biax after you have it wetted out adn squeegee it smooth, this removes excess epoxy (gives youa better glass to resin and strength to weight ratio) and fairs the joint in nicely (which is the real benefit). You rip it off the fillet when done and it leaves a real nice surface. Not enough people use it." So I'm imagining the peel ply as some type of saran wrap stuff that goes on the very outside of my fillets after I have put down the fiberglass tape and then comes off before the epoxy cures? Do you wet out the peel ply and then pull it off? Does it soak up the extra epoxy? I'm wondering how this makes the boat easier to fair. Mr. Gentry, I appreciate the welcome. I've only been over this way for a little of year and have at least 3 more years to go. Little Rock is a lot better town than where I came from. Hess Robertson
 
Mr. Todd, "A final suggestion for a biax user (the smaller boats don't use biax on the fillets)... buy a few yards of peel ply. If you don't know what it is, peel ply is a woven fabric that does an amazing job in helping you create quality and clean laminates for your fillets. You put it on top of your biax after you have it wetted out adn squeegee it smooth, this removes excess epoxy (gives youa better glass to resin and strength to weight ratio) and fairs the joint in nicely (which is the real benefit). You rip it off the fillet when done and it leaves a real nice surface. Not enough people use it." So I'm imagining the peel ply as some type of saran wrap stuff that goes on the very outside of my fillets after I have put down the fiberglass tape and then comes off before the epoxy cures? Do you wet out the peel ply and then pull it off? Does it soak up the extra epoxy? I'm wondering how this makes the boat easier to fair. Mr. Gentry, I appreciate the welcome. I've only been over this way for a little of year and have at least 3 more years to go. Little Rock is a lot better town than where I came from. Hess Robertson
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The peel ply is a woven fabric, so not a film like saran wrap (epoxy can pass through it, but not easily). It goes on the outside after the laminate is wetted out. You can squeegee it and squeeze the extra resin out and it leaves a smooth surface to the fillet that basically does not have to be faired. It is removed after the epoxy is cured (it just rips off - amazing). If you haven't seen biax, it is strands of glass stitched together, not a fabric like most fiberglass. When you make a laminate using biax, they are really rough and have stitching that needs ground off and it needs faired - basically a lot of work to clean up. With peel ply, a biax fillet is basically faired if you are good with it it is done.
 
So is the peel ply a 1 and done deal or is it reusable? This is another novice question: What is the best kind of wire for the stitching? I read about people using fencing wire, bailing wire, etc.
 
So is the peel ply a 1 and done deal or is it reusable? This is another novice question: What is the best kind of wire for the stitching? I read about people using fencing wire, bailing wire, etc.
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Since I'm at it. I have never reused peel ply. It isn't very expensive and you don't need mych to do your fillets. Cut 4-6" wider than widest glass.

You can make wire as big a deal as you wan't. I used soft steel fence wire of the gauge Devlin suggested. I would not use cable ties for that boat.
 
The biggest advantage to peel ply is the fact that its use over and epoxy covered area makes a very good bonding surface when it is peeled up. That area dose not require the sanding prep that must be done if it is not used.

One time consumable.
 
I'd consider a transom angle of 17 to 19 degrees because it is easier to trim a motor up than down. You run out of range on the downward side.
 
Well, got plywood in yesterday, i ordered world panel's meranti hydrocore lite (supposedly just as strong as regular hydrocore but with about 10% less weight plus they only had enough for half of my order or 12 mm so they gave me okoume for the same price as the hydrocore lite to fill the rest of my order, should have epoxy and fiberglass here in a few days, got some work tables set up, will start with scarfing and then make a cradle for construction, will take and post some pics when I get a chance to start some work, I really appreciate all the suggestions and advice
 
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