Hunting dogs
- Thread starter AG Drew
- Start date
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Eddie Kershaw
Guest
AG
In my view GSP,s and wiemariner,s are pointing dogs and has such should be used for what they are intended for upland hunting, this is where they excel , if you want a water dog you should be looking at Labs and chessie,s and bokins and such like. I hope this helps to anwser your question.
Take care and God Bless
Eddie and Amber
Its all about Building that Bond.
In my view GSP,s and wiemariner,s are pointing dogs and has such should be used for what they are intended for upland hunting, this is where they excel , if you want a water dog you should be looking at Labs and chessie,s and bokins and such like. I hope this helps to anwser your question.
Take care and God Bless
Eddie and Amber
Its all about Building that Bond.
Scott Farris
Well-known member
Welcome to the site!
I hear Canada can get kind of cool. I guess as long as you get them fitted for a dry suit you should be fine. I'd be tempted to be hunting with a Boykin Spaniel if it didn't get so blasted cold here in CT in the late season. My first hunting dog was a Springer and he did a lot of shivering by the end of the early season in NH. I do love my labs and feel they are a great selection for the North East.
Best,
Scott
I hear Canada can get kind of cool. I guess as long as you get them fitted for a dry suit you should be fine. I'd be tempted to be hunting with a Boykin Spaniel if it didn't get so blasted cold here in CT in the late season. My first hunting dog was a Springer and he did a lot of shivering by the end of the early season in NH. I do love my labs and feel they are a great selection for the North East.
Best,
Scott
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Eddie Kershaw
Guest
Ag
First of all let me say welcome to furom, In my view there is no such thing as a alround hunting dog, each dog is bread for its own special purpose, and each bread will excel in what they do better that other breads, you would not take a springer and exspect it to do the job of a pointer, the springer was bread to chase the rabits and pheasents out of the edgerows where the pointer was there to point out the game to his master and on command flush it,
there again your not going to get better water dogs than the retrievers ie Lab, chessie, golden to name a few so I beleave you should get the bread thats suits your type of hunting whether it be upland or waterfowling, I hope this helps mate in your consideration on the bread you require.
Take care and God Bless
Eddie and Amber
Its all about Building that Bond.
First of all let me say welcome to furom, In my view there is no such thing as a alround hunting dog, each dog is bread for its own special purpose, and each bread will excel in what they do better that other breads, you would not take a springer and exspect it to do the job of a pointer, the springer was bread to chase the rabits and pheasents out of the edgerows where the pointer was there to point out the game to his master and on command flush it,
there again your not going to get better water dogs than the retrievers ie Lab, chessie, golden to name a few so I beleave you should get the bread thats suits your type of hunting whether it be upland or waterfowling, I hope this helps mate in your consideration on the bread you require.
Take care and God Bless
Eddie and Amber
Its all about Building that Bond.
Chuck J
Well-known member
I'm no expert, but I knew a old guy who hunted on the same lake as us when I was young, and he had a GSP that was a great water dog, and he used him for pheasants as well. However I have heard the exact opposite from Rutgers ...
http://www.duckboats.net/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=63698#63698
It's much more commical to hear Paully tell the story in person...
And that is the extent of my knowledge on the subject
http://www.duckboats.net/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=63698#63698
It's much more commical to hear Paully tell the story in person...
And that is the extent of my knowledge on the subject
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Eddie Kershaw
Guest
Chuck
Thats what I call a pointer, why have a dog and retrieve the bird yourself, I bet that dog was saying to its self what that stupid fart yelling at he can get it himself now. HeHehe.
Take care and God Bless
Eddie and Amber
Its all about Building that Bond.
Thats what I call a pointer, why have a dog and retrieve the bird yourself, I bet that dog was saying to its self what that stupid fart yelling at he can get it himself now. HeHehe.
Take care and God Bless
Eddie and Amber
Its all about Building that Bond.
AG
I have to agree with the group here. If you have your heart set on a versatile breed you can surely get them to retrieve to pretty good standards. However, they are never as happy as when they are hunting and pointing game. After owning a Vizsla and hunting over a couple Weimaraners and numerous German Shorthairs I have been a very happy Lab owner and we are on number two. My vizsla did not enjoy sitting in a duck boat or the marsh for long periods or extreme cold. Even in Florida's temperate climate the cold got to him pretty quickly. He was a decent retriever but nothing like a lab, that right out of the box, loves bringing you birds and can sit at the ready until the birds fall from the sky. Now get him in a field and watch him go for hours.
You can get a lab to hunt for birds and even point but, they wont be able to cover the ground like a German or
English pointer. An old friend had some Argentenian Pointers that were world class quail and pheasnat birds. He paid large sums of money for these dogs but even on the retrieve they wanted to look for more birds instead of bringing you the dead bird. They would do it but, not like a lab. I know Labs are pretty common and every neighborhood has several so its not quite as cool as other more exotic breeds but man they are loyal, easy to train, good at home, and make bang up duck and goose dogs.
Just my tw0 cents.
Regards,
Tony
I have to agree with the group here. If you have your heart set on a versatile breed you can surely get them to retrieve to pretty good standards. However, they are never as happy as when they are hunting and pointing game. After owning a Vizsla and hunting over a couple Weimaraners and numerous German Shorthairs I have been a very happy Lab owner and we are on number two. My vizsla did not enjoy sitting in a duck boat or the marsh for long periods or extreme cold. Even in Florida's temperate climate the cold got to him pretty quickly. He was a decent retriever but nothing like a lab, that right out of the box, loves bringing you birds and can sit at the ready until the birds fall from the sky. Now get him in a field and watch him go for hours.
You can get a lab to hunt for birds and even point but, they wont be able to cover the ground like a German or
English pointer. An old friend had some Argentenian Pointers that were world class quail and pheasnat birds. He paid large sums of money for these dogs but even on the retrieve they wanted to look for more birds instead of bringing you the dead bird. They would do it but, not like a lab. I know Labs are pretty common and every neighborhood has several so its not quite as cool as other more exotic breeds but man they are loyal, easy to train, good at home, and make bang up duck and goose dogs.
Just my tw0 cents.
Regards,
Tony
Terry Desilets
Active member
My last dog was a Weim, currently I have a 1yr GSP. I love duck hinting, but I love upland game dogs. Technically bith breeds are considerend "versitile", however, as had been mentioned, if it's cold, there's nothing to keep 'em warm. Not to mention, both breeds are high speed low drag dogs, asking them to sit motionless but attentive for long periods is torture.
I had my Weim out duck hunting in early November (Michigan), it was cold, but I had a neoprene vest on him, it was kinda quiet and I hear chattering, now I mostly hunt alone and I wasn't all that cold, I looked at Zeke and he was just miserable, teeth chattering away. I felt awful, I took my jacket off and wrapped him up. It was a short day. Duke, my GSP loves the water, but I doubt that he'll be going duck hunting. He is progressing along into a nice pointer.
That said, it's your call, both these dogs would be anywhere I was,no matter the condition, they are extremely loyal and bond well. If you tell your GSP that he's a duck dog, he'll be a duck dog for you. Personally, I think you should look for a dog more dedicated to cold water environments.
Good luck!
I had my Weim out duck hunting in early November (Michigan), it was cold, but I had a neoprene vest on him, it was kinda quiet and I hear chattering, now I mostly hunt alone and I wasn't all that cold, I looked at Zeke and he was just miserable, teeth chattering away. I felt awful, I took my jacket off and wrapped him up. It was a short day. Duke, my GSP loves the water, but I doubt that he'll be going duck hunting. He is progressing along into a nice pointer.
That said, it's your call, both these dogs would be anywhere I was,no matter the condition, they are extremely loyal and bond well. If you tell your GSP that he's a duck dog, he'll be a duck dog for you. Personally, I think you should look for a dog more dedicated to cold water environments.
Good luck!
john townsend
Active member
Lab or Chessie best options. I have both. I do not like watching a dog shiver.
Geoff Schroeder
Member
I'm a chessie owner, but I'd love to hear some feedback in regards to the griffon. I have met exactly one and his owner (in CT) used him over planted pheasants and for seaducks. So howzabout it? Any Griffon supporters out there?
AG Drew
New member
Hi All
Thanks for the informative replies. Dont get me wrong guys, I love my Lab. I' put a good Lab up against any other retriever out there for water sports, Chessies included. Just had an idea and wanted some informed opinions.I'll stay with Labs, they have too much character.To look at mine you would'nt think he was a Lab. I got him from a reputable breeder and he is registered so I know he's a pure breed but he looks like a hound. Tall and skinny. round head and long ears. Todays Labs are the result of the original Labrador dogs being taken to England and bred to English hunting dogs and years latter viola, the Labrador Retriever. Well, Midas inherited all the dormant genes from his ancestors.
Thanks for the informative replies. Dont get me wrong guys, I love my Lab. I' put a good Lab up against any other retriever out there for water sports, Chessies included. Just had an idea and wanted some informed opinions.I'll stay with Labs, they have too much character.To look at mine you would'nt think he was a Lab. I got him from a reputable breeder and he is registered so I know he's a pure breed but he looks like a hound. Tall and skinny. round head and long ears. Todays Labs are the result of the original Labrador dogs being taken to England and bred to English hunting dogs and years latter viola, the Labrador Retriever. Well, Midas inherited all the dormant genes from his ancestors.
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Eddie Kershaw
Guest
AG
I have a pure English Lab a Drakeshead and I would,nt trade her for all the money in the world.
Take care and God Bless
Eddie and Amber
Its all about Building that Bond.
I have a pure English Lab a Drakeshead and I would,nt trade her for all the money in the world.
Take care and God Bless
Eddie and Amber
Its all about Building that Bond.
Steve Ybarzabal
New member
I've really enjoyed reading everyone's responses to the original post. I had a wonderful yellow lab for 13 years and lost her last year. She was an outstanding retriever and really enjoyed an occasional upland hunt. When it was time to start looking for a replacement, I looked seriously at the Griffon, but I just couldn't pull the trigger. That was when I met a Spinone breeder, and I was hooked on the ancient breed. I have always had labs, but this may be the last breed of dog I ever own. My Spinone is almost 11 months old now and is progressing very well. In fact, this week while training, he was doing land-water-land retrieves, stopping and taking casts on whistle, and doing marked doubles. During the summer, while retrieving dummies, he stopped halfway and locked up on a point. I immediately ran out to him to do some fussing, and to my surprise, a quail flushed. He has been the easiest dog to train, and his temperment is wonderful.
Jim Strutty
New member
I will not go on about what great dogs the Griffon's are but if you want to know more you can shoot me a pm. He is never cold...and really does not mind sitting still in a blind. The best thing I like about Gus is that if he marks the bird down he will work independently. If he doesn't see the mark I can either direct him or let him search on his own. He is trained to search for up a half an hour without a command from me using his nose to find birds.
I appreciate labs for what they do but I have been with way too many labs that were boot heel dogs. If you want a lab you really have to do your homework on the breeder.
I appreciate labs for what they do but I have been with way too many labs that were boot heel dogs. If you want a lab you really have to do your homework on the breeder.
Jim Strutty
New member
Eddie I have not hunted in England but those I know who have speak of the wonderful specialist breeds that are used there. Here in the states and in much of central Europe we prize a versatile dog that will do it all well. The GSP that pointed dead would not have been any good to me whether we were on water or land. I don't put up with a dog that won't fetch when told to. They know when they are sent to fetch and pointing has nothing to do with it.
It can be easily trained to any dog, Labs just have been selected to naturally want to retrieve.
The only reason my dog has pointed while on retrieve is when he already has the bird in his mouth and finds another and points it. I'll gladly go and shoot that bird while he waits to deliver the first bird.
good hunting to you,
Jim
mike braden
Well-known member
AG Drew - there are two "types" of Labs. English - short and stocky. American - taller and leaner. In my opinion the English and Irish refined and made the breed better. We Americans turns them into 120 lbs marshmellows.
The Labrador has been the AKC top dog for many years. Unfortunately many of those registrations are for famiy pets only. While many more of the Griffon owners will use them for their intended use - hunting.
Many dog "clubs" do not want their dogs to go mainstream for fear of polluting the lines. The WPG is one such instance. They have strict breeding standards. Some dog clubs will not even recognize the litter if they do not approve of the parents.
I, like many, think that the dogs should be kept to their intended purpose. Even though my lab "occasionally" flash points and I "ocassionally" like it to give my butt an chance to get ready. Nothing dishearts me more than to see a pointing lab. It doesn't matter if they might do it well, it is not their intended purpose. Would you by an Elhew pointer and try to make him a flusher or worse a duck dog? I've actually seen German Shepards out phesant hunting?!
You can call a Griffon or Weim a versatile breed but they will always be a pointing breed to me. That is what they do best and that is what their intended purpose was.
The Labrador has been the AKC top dog for many years. Unfortunately many of those registrations are for famiy pets only. While many more of the Griffon owners will use them for their intended use - hunting.
Many dog "clubs" do not want their dogs to go mainstream for fear of polluting the lines. The WPG is one such instance. They have strict breeding standards. Some dog clubs will not even recognize the litter if they do not approve of the parents.
I, like many, think that the dogs should be kept to their intended purpose. Even though my lab "occasionally" flash points and I "ocassionally" like it to give my butt an chance to get ready. Nothing dishearts me more than to see a pointing lab. It doesn't matter if they might do it well, it is not their intended purpose. Would you by an Elhew pointer and try to make him a flusher or worse a duck dog? I've actually seen German Shepards out phesant hunting?!
You can call a Griffon or Weim a versatile breed but they will always be a pointing breed to me. That is what they do best and that is what their intended purpose was.
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I feel compelled to add my own two cents here. I've owned shorthairs my entire life...I think I'm on number five. We even raised a litter of them. They are - bar none - the best upland dogs I've ever hunted behind - especially for birds that stick like quail or grouse. Runners (pheasants) can be a challenge to any good pointing dog, but if they get enough experience they figure the game out quickly. They are good family dogs and can adapt well to kennel life. Some are excellent retreivers, but most need training to excel at it.
Now that my hunting preferences have switched over to waterfowl (for many reasons), I think my current GSP is the last (pictured in my icon). Noah is a great dog, but he's fourteen and isn't up to sitting still in a boat or putting up with cold water. I'll be getting a lab when he passes on and will have many fond memories of my shorthair friends.
If you want an excellent water dog - get a lab. If you want an excellent upland bird dog - get a GSP.
Kevin
Now that my hunting preferences have switched over to waterfowl (for many reasons), I think my current GSP is the last (pictured in my icon). Noah is a great dog, but he's fourteen and isn't up to sitting still in a boat or putting up with cold water. I'll be getting a lab when he passes on and will have many fond memories of my shorthair friends.
If you want an excellent water dog - get a lab. If you want an excellent upland bird dog - get a GSP.
Kevin