The Mallard Boat

Dave E

Dave E

Active member
Greetings all,

I have just ordered the plans for Devlin's Mallard. I have since learned that particular boat is a slow poke. I am not all that concerned with speed, but I do hunt the Nisqually Flats area on Puget Sound. Sometimes I need to go 5 to 8 miles after I launch to get where I am going. If it is windy, where will be sizeable waves. I have hunted this area many times in a 12 foot jon boat that scared me to death more than once. The light aluminum boat was far too tippy for an old fat guy wearing waders. By the way, the speed of the Jon boat with the 8 HP was OK for me.

MOST of the time I will be alone with my dog. SOME of the time I will be with my son. We are both about 240 pounds, the dog is about 70 or so, I guess (yellow Lab). I have an 8 HP 2 stroke motor. If I can go about 10 or so miles an hour, that should be fine, I think.

In reading some of your're guy's posts, I have develped a couple of questions: Will my 8 HP do what I need? and 2:

What does it take to make the modification to make this a planing hull? Is this a totally seperate boat plan, or is it a matter of reshaping a part here and there?

Dave
Gig Harbor, WA
 
Dave,

I think the boat you are asking about is the Black Brant lll. I built one and for the conditions you describe is the minimum I'd use. I say that though I have never been in a Mallard but have hunted next to one. The BBlll is designed as a planeing hull and will handle the load you want to put in it. I have hunted two guys your size and a 100 lb dog in some nasty weather and was very confident in the boat. There should be someone in your area who has built a BBlll you could talk to and maybe catch a ride in. You're not that far from Devlin's shop, maybe he has one of each or knows those who have built one.

Hopefully one of the Mallard builders will chime in with a better opinion of their boat.
 
Comments from TWO Mallard hunters here in Washington...one of them immediately got rid of the boat after only a couple of trips and the other one got tire d of my incessantly running circles around him on hunting trips in my Barnegat, (which is no speed merchant itself)....

I've not owned one but have hunted in their company....they'll carry the same load a 12' Barnegat will, they're stable, they hunt well, but they are not going to get you anywhere fast.....

Since Devlin has so many designs if you want a planing boat I'd recommend getting the plans for a planing boat rather than messing with re-engineering planes to make a displacement hull a planing hull, and maybe "missing" the goal completely....

Steve
 
Just to add to what others have said about the Black Brant III I built one last year. An 8hp is not going to get it on plane even going down hill which is not recomended because waterfalls can damage the boat....

I ran a 15hp on mine last year and with me and no gear it jumped up well. With full load of gear and dog it still made it on plane. With another guy it did not.

Dont discount a Black Brant II either its a displacement hull so its slower but very safe in rough water. Not to say I am not happy with the III in rough water.
 
[font=Verdana,Arial,Helvetica]Since Devlin has so many designs if you want a planing boat I'd recommend getting the plans for a ...

Well that's the thing, isn't it? I guess what I am asking here is what is the difference between a displacement and a planing boat. Now before you start tying things, what I am asking is what is the technical design difference. I know a displacement hull pushes water while a planing boat climbs up on top. Please spare me all the stuff about that. I want to know angles, shapes, etc.. I mean "what is THE difference?" My dad used to tell me the difference between Ford, Chevy Plymouth etc. Fords had square head lights and Chevy's had round ones (for some particular year). That is what I am asking, if you can follow me. Sometimes the differences are slight and sometimes not. ... and it is the Mallard I am talking about. All else is apples and oranges. Sometimes I have trouble conveying what I am asking exactly.

Dave

I
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(those that answer your question), and then demand the correct answer, and by god we better read your mind to make sure we don't waste your time with superfluous answers......

Simple answer.....go to the Devlin website and pull up the little drawings for a Mallard and a Black Brant III......look at the side views....look at the difference in the pofiles.....the Mallards shows ALOT of rocker....the BRANT III has an almost flat hull.....one GOES FAST, and one GOES SLOW...now in the spirit of good teaching where the teacher challanges the student to figure out things on their own, which one do you think will "go fast"....and which one will "go slow"....looking at the profles of the boat will also allow you to answer your own question about which one will handle rough water better....


Steve
 
My apologizes I didn't mean to offend you. Its just that I am confused and only have enough funds to try this once.

I'll not bother you again.
 
The difference, Dave, is rocker in the hull. The rocker gives quite a bit of reserve bouyance if you will and allows the boat to ride the waves much easier. Visualize a sail boat. A sailing hull is a classic displacement hull. The maximum speed of a displacement hull can be figured out before the boat is even built because it is based on a formula and relates to only one dimension on the boat - the length at the water line. For example if the length of the boat at the water line is 12 feet then the maximum theoretical speed in knots is 4.64 knots. The formula is 1.34 times the square root of the LWL.

In your original scenerio you indicated some conditions for the boat you want to build. Those conditions and the load you want to carry point right at the Black Brant series of Devlin designs not the Mallard - IMHO. The difference between the Black Brant ll and the lll is that much of the rocker has been removed to get to a more planing hull of the lll - exactly what you propose to do with the Mallard. My original answer to you tried to point this out. If you already have the plans for the Mallard and want to change to the BBlll you might talk to Sam Devlin about exchanging them - it's happened before.

If you want to experiment with the Mallard - good luck, I hope you succeed. Bear in mind that though boat design is not rocket science, it does take some experience to visualize what effect changing dimensions will have on a finished hull. Personally, I didn't want to take the chance on ruining $1500 worth of materials on a "might work" so got the design that I knew was going to work for me the first time.
 
I have had my mallard for about 6 seasons now and if you are going to be traveling any distance the mallard is going to be very slow, with its rocker hull it lends itself to rowing more than a motor. The boat itself is very stable but on big water I would want a different boat with more speed. I would not recommend redesigning a hull on my first boat building project, you will have enough challenges just following the plans. I run a 3hp motor on my mallard and I don't think you will get her to go any faster with a bigger motor.
 
just thought it your post "demanding" THE answer, and ONLY THE ANSWER, was an intersting way to couch your response to the answers to your question....

Stick around....there's not better place on the internet to get answers while you're deciding, and building, the boat that you finally choose....just don't expect, EXACT, BRIEF, answers to every question...

Steve
 
Dave,

I was one of the Mallard owners that Steve referred to.

First thing you need to know is that there is absolutely no way in hell that two 240lb guys a 70lb dog and a load of decoys is ever going to work in the Mallard. I'm like 185lb and hunting with my kid when he was 8 years old and my dog back when he was skinny was cramped in that cockpit. The boat in my avatar is the Mallard so you can get an idea of how much room there really is.

Second, if you plan on running 8 miles to get to your spot you had better set out at the very least 2 hours before the time you want to start hunting....this is no joke....I was running a 9.9 hp on mine.

If your funds only allow you to do this once I would say you really need to look at a different design that will fit your needs better and then save up some more bucks. Bigger boat, bigger motor = bigger $$$$.
 
There is no reason to redesign the Mallard into a planing hull when her sister the Bluebill exists. Even if you couldn't return the plans you would be far ahead to simply buy the Bluebill plans rather than try to modify your current ones. The plans are cheap compared to materails and time.

Specs. from the devllin site:

Bluebilll
wt. 155 lbs
load 610 lbs
hp. 20
cockpit 7’-0” x 3’-3”
length beam 12’-1”x 4’-11”
draft 6¾”

Mallard
wt.155 lbs
load 580 lbs
hp. 15
cockpit 7’-0” x 3’-7”
length beam 12’-11” x 4’-10”
draft 5”



Bluebill
Sneakbox
people 1-2
20hp – 28mph
eight 3 (10½")
CS-8
OW-5

Mallard
Sneakbox
people 1-2
15hp – 15mph
height 3 (14" NF)
CS-7
OW-4.5

Seaworthiness Factors:
CS : Close to shore

OW : Open Water

Scale: 1 - calm, 10 - gale conditions
 
[font=Verdana,Arial,Helvetica](re-post) The difference, Dave, is rocker in the hull. (snip) The maximum speed of a displacement hull can be figured out before the boat is even built because it is based on a formula and relates to only one dimension on the boat - the length at the water line. (snip) The formula is 1.34 times the square root of the LWL.


Now that is what I was looking for! Thank you for that. Interesting stuff that I know little about. I can see by the help I have received that I have selected the wrong boat. I understand that I should built the Black Brant II. I still have no idea what a "rocker hull" is, but I will find out. Since reading some of your replies (some of them where helpful) I called Sam Devlin and made arrangements to exchange my plans for a different set. I will be having coffee with him next week. I didn't want to build a real big boat because the places I hunt are sometimes "skinny water" and I need to get right into the weeds. Many times I leave the boat and walk in someplace nearby and hunker down in the weeds. Too bad there is not a truly an all around boat. I have borrowed my friends Poke Boat (brand name) and that was OK for me, but that is only a one man boat and impossible to paddle long distances (for me).

Dave Engstrom




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(re-post) [font=Verdana,Arial,Helvetica]I have had my mallard for about 6 seasons now and if you are going to be traveling any distance the mallard is going to be very slow, with its rocker hull it lends itself to rowing more than a motor.

Thanks Greg, I am learning that you may be correct. Doubting myself, I went back to Devlin's site and looked at the pictures of the Mallard. They are very crappy drawings. They show the front of the boat curving up out of the water like the rest of them. From what others are saying, this is not the case. I asked Sam for better pictures of that boat, but he didn't have any. I guess the thing that attracted me to it was the canvas cover on the front. It rains every damn day here in that part of the year.
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Now, you're on the right track. Sitting down with Sam for an hour will give you more knowledge than a month on this forum.

Rocker is: Very basically, rocker is the amount of curve that the hull appears to have when viewed from the side. In this discussion it relates to if a hull will plane or not and that is determined by the amount of rocker from amidship aft to the transom. If the line from amidship to the transom is straight and horizontal it will be thought of as a "planeing hull". If that line is a convex line that rises as it meets the transom it is more along the lines of a displacement hull and may be very difficult to plane. Think of it this way, if the hull is spoon shaped it has rocker, if it's shaped like a spatula it doesn't.

Good Luck,
 
Greetings all,


MOST of the time I will be alone with my dog. SOME of the time I will be with my son. We are both about 240 pounds, the dog is about 70 or so, I guess (yellow Lab).
Click to expand...
Based on this one statement you will only be satisfied in your conditions using a Black Brant III. The Bluebill is a miniture version of the BB3 and will handle two men (smaller than you and your son) and a dog, but you are going to be shoulder to shoulder the whole time and the dog will be in someone's lap half the time. The Bluebill will still be better than your john boat. With Eden Saw wood supply down the highway from you and several over the counter fiberglass retailers in the area your construction cost between a Bluebill/Mallard and a BB3 will be less than $100. You will need a 25hp motor and a larger trailer and Craigslist can supply used motors and trailers all over your area. There have been days in my BB3 that I whished I had built a Cackler or Snowgoose, but most days the BB3 with just myself is a pretty good deal. Some day I might even try it on the Salt for some Harli's and scoters, but it is a long way to drive.
 
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