10 gauge again, good and bad

Matt Moore

Matt Moore

Active member
I tried my American Arms 10 ga about three weeks ago on a goose hunt. I'm very happy with how I shot with it. The gun fit's great, I hit geese, and hit them hard, didn't notice the recoil, and was absolutely thrilled with it.
Now the bad news, when I cleaned it at the end of the day, I discovered the barrels are scored! I set in the gun cabinet, didn't talk to my wife, my hunting buddy, or anyone about it for a few days. I finally faced the fact I'd damaged the gun, and now I'm fessing up to the group, and asking for advice. I figure I've got a few options, some of them not so hot...
1. Leave in the closet, and let the kids sell it when I'm dead. I won't sell it the way it is.
2. Keep shooting geese with it until it's ruined.
3. Clean up the scoring best as I can, and use it for coyotes and turkeys. I know there's hevi-shot and such, but I can't stand the thought of 5 bucks every time it goes bang.
4. Send it off some place that will chrome line the bores.
5. Try to find steel shot rated barrels that would fit. This is highly unlikely, I've never fitted smokeless shotgun barrels, but this would probably test my gunsmith skills to the limit.
6. Live with #1 and find another o/u 10 ga that shoots steel.
1 & 2 are really hard to even contemplate, yeah it's just metal and wood, but there was nothing wrong with this gun until I stuffed steel into it, I've never done this sort of thing to a gun before, and I'm ashamed.
Does anybody know who does chrome lining that's reputable, and what it costs. The gun isn't worth alot of money, but any gun that shoots where you're looking is worth more to that shooter than market value.
 
Hi Matt,
I had a similar experience with an old AYA 10 Ga. double. To the dealers credit he allowed me to trade it on an Ithaca mag 10. Had no trouble with that and shot it until I realized all I really needed was a 3" 12 Ga.

Try the folks you bought it from first if you bought it new. If you bought it from a private individual second hand you are just going to have to live with it. I wouldn't spend good money after bad having the barrells chrome lined etc. Let it be a learning experience and always know your seller well before you buy.

Just my $.02 worth.
Merry Christmas,
Harry
 
I pretty sure you can get just about any shotgun's barrels sleeved. Oh, I just checked the price at Briley.com, $1750. Ouch!!
 
Matt

Can you explain ([font=Verdana,Arial,Helvetica]scored). A good gunsmith can hone a few thousands out no problem. If your talking about groves from the steel shoot coming out of the protective cup early, I would not give that a second thought. I have a 870 that looks almost rifled. When steel first come out on the market before it was required, I tried it. It was very hard on barrels. That is when I grooved by 870.

If it bothers you that bad try using a tornado bore brush with a drill,that will clean up some scoring. Just my 2 cents.


James Roberts
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Matt,
I assume they barrells are just scored at the choke section. If it is scored the whole length your
have ammo problems. Your shotcup is not doing its job.
If it's just at the choke you can have them opened. Mike Orlen , a gunsmith in Mass.,
opened mine a few years ago, I think it ran me $50.00 a barrell.
If the full length is scored, get with Ballistic Products and order thier 10ga manual.
Well worth the price just for general information, even if you never reload.

I wouldnt worry too much about opening the chokes either. I have been known
to slam eider and scoter with a skeet choke. I made a mistake and didnt
change the choke after shooting clays, and didnt notice till someone asked me why
I had a skeet choke in. Worked so well I kept using it.
 
For over the decoys I use a skeet choke in all my guns. For general rough and tumble shooting (including close to medium range passing shots I use a Trulock Skeet 2).

The Trulock choke is one of the best if not the best I've ever used. Look up Trulock chokes on the web and give George a call. He can probably give you some excellent advice on polishing out and tubing most any gun.

My $.02 worth,
Harry
 
What size shot were you using? You mentioned Hevi Shot but that is worse on a barrel than steel. Having said that...I reload Hevi in my 28ga and have shot it for two seasons through an old 11-48 Rem. that was made in the 50's with no scoring at all. It sounds more like your shells are to blame. I'd just shoot it but use a size or two smaller shot. I think Dave Shady Larsen shot one of those for a few years.
 
What size shot were you using? You mentioned Hevi Shot but that is worse on a barrel than steel. Having said that...I reload Hevi in my 28ga and have shot it for two seasons through an old 11-48 Rem. that was made in the 50's with no scoring at all. It sounds more like your shells are to blame. I'd just shoot it but use a size or two smaller shot. I think Dave Shady Larsen shot one of those for a few years.
Click to expand...


Ditto Lee's post.

Unless it is choked very tight I wouldn't think there would be much of an issue with that gun. I'd be more worried about getting a very slight bulge on a double. That doesn't do much on a single barrel but have heard it might cause problems on a double.
Most of the scores caused by early steel were cosmetic, with todays wads there has to be a problem for shot to get through. I even shoot cheap steel through my old gun and haven't seen scoring but I don't shoot anything bigger then 2's.

Tim
 
Hey Matt, let me run a different kind of question by you....Are you sure the barrels are scored and not just gooked up with residue from the wad? I ask as way back when steel was first required, I shot some early steel loads through a 12 ga Over/Under my father had given me for my 18th B-day. After cleaning the gun, I looked through the barrels and saw what I was sure was scoring at various points along the length of the barrel. I thought I'd ruined it. Talk about not wanting to admit to my father that I'd ruined the big B-day present....

After a couple of days when I finally got my emotions under control, I mention this to a much more knowledgable friend than I, who suggested that it was wad residue and that he gets it all the time in each of his Belgian Brownings. Go back and scrub it with a brass bristle bore brush he said. I did and the scoring went away.

As to choke recomendations, all I can say is this, ALL of the waterfowl hunting I've done in the last 20 years has been with the Imp Cyl chokes in my Citori, and I've never felt under gunned. Geese, eiders, goldeneyes, and teal. One choke, all the time.
 
Mat,
get Tom Rosters book on shotgun barrel modifications and read it. He spent a ton of time when steel was being developed. Other than Bob Bristers work on Lead, I think this book is tops for Steel shooters.
I shoot my churchill ten ga SxS and its one of my fav late season memories when the wind is howling and the shots are crossing on the salt.
 
The loads are 1 1/2 oz steel T shot, Reloading Specialties Sam 1 wads, with buffer, Steel powder. The chokes are modified and improved. I do have some BPI multimetal wads too, that I loaded 1 1/4 oz steel #2, in case any ducks showed, but it was the T loads that scored it. I've got Reloading Specialties booklet, and BPI's 10ga booklet as well. The gun did well on the pattern board, when I tested it a couple of days before hunting, and I thought the streaks in the barrels were just power and wad residue. But after hunting that day, the gun was very wet, and I really cleaned it, and the barrels are scored.
I'm wondering if I shot wads with no splits, if I could get away with that. Reducing the velocity would defeat the whole purpose of loading a premium shell. I'll keep researching, and thanks for all the advice. BPI also sells some tyvek sleaves, has anybody used these?
 
It is a shame that company is no longer around. I worked for a rep group that was one of the original sales groups that represented American Arms. The gun was sold as steel shot safe, but I don't know where you go from here.
 
I would blame it on the T shot. Dad has an American Arms 10 ga SXS with full chokes and accidentally ran some BB steel through it. The chokes are scored but it still rolls turkeys with lead and drops ducks with steel #3's with no further damage. I would not worry about the damage but would back off to BB's given the chockes you have. Purely opinion with a LITTLE experience to back it up.

Best wishes and MERRY CHRISTMAS!

Gene

ps. I'd buy that gun in a heartbeat! Even with the scoring.
 
If you have to stick with shot that big, get some Mylar wraps for inside the wad. Use Mica on the wads and dust your shot with it too, it will help let it slip as it goes through the choke.
 
As stated previously, I own an American arms 10 ga SxS with 26" barrels and factory choke tubes along with a 32" O/U with five custom made 3 5/8" ported chote tubes made by Larry Nailon from Clearview Products in Oklahoma. I have extensive experience with both guns and have experimented with numerous reloads in both steel and lead.

Like Gene experienced above, I scored one of my factory full choke tubes with steel BBs (Federal factory). It was clearly my fault because there is no reason whatsoever to shoot steel through that much constriction designed for extra full lead turkey loads. Not only is it asking for trouble, it blows patterns. It was just a stupid mistake one particularly fine hunt when I ran out of small steel reloads and went back to the truck for a handful of factory BBs I had in reserve. The scoring looks ugly, but believe it or not has minimal to no effect on patterns.

Matt, I have no idea how you scored the crome lined barrel??? It just doesn't make sense, but I suppose that large T shot found some way to bridge inside the wad and score the crome. First of all, your gun is certainly not ruined and will serve you your entire hunting career just as it stands. You will not polish score marks out of chrome, but there is an excellent solution if you so desire that will greatly improve the performance of your mighty ten.

The ultimate solution is to have all the chrome removed in a back boring machining operation and then have custom ported chokes made up at the same time. Larry Nailon from Clearview Products is the best in the country at this when it comes to the 10 gauge. Removing the chrome will not be cheap, but the performance from an oversize bore in combination with long ported choke tubes will take your shotgun to performance levels that you may never be able to shoot well enough to utilize!

I have a set of five 3 5/8 inch ported tubes from Clearview Products that range all the way to only .003 constriction to what amounts to extra full steel in .045. What makes the American Arms O/U such an unbelievable piece of equipment is that the double triggers allow instant selection of an ideal short range or long range load. I use the front trigger and almost cylinder bore .003 constriction with steel #3s that lays out a very sizable wall of death from just over the decoys to 45 yards. The rear trigger shoots a full choke load (.040) of steel BB's (premium round and high polished) that will run all day with the fancy exotic non-toxic shot at long range. I'm also a predator hunter and have similar long and short range loads perfected with lead shot.

My suggestion is to go for the gusto and have your gun back bored with custom choke tubes!
 
As far as I know, these bores aren't chrome lined, but the back boring is still a great suggestion, one I should've come up with on my own. After everyone's responses, I'm feeling less stressed about the gun. When elk season's over I'll get back to hunting waterfowl. I've found I like the double triggers better than single selective, just as fast in the normal order, and faster if you want the far choke first. I'll probably swap the triggers so the rear trigger is farther away from the palm of my hand, I'm a lefty. I already did this with my muzzleloaders, the triggers land on the same part of the forefinger this way.
 
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