Beginning carving--cork or wood?

I thought I would join the fray. Wood is less expensive, though as stated, a little more elbow greases is needed to shape it.

When you get the level of your wood decoys to the size, shape, and standards you want, you can buy the expensive high density cork and have an almost indestructible decoy. At this point your high density cork will be less expensive than wood.
 

I prefer to use High Density cork in my classes as it is easier to carve in a shorter amount of time and can be carved with a couple of inexpensive hand tools. HD Cork sands smooth, takes detail well, and makes a very durable decoy. Over the years I have carved decoys out of Wood, Foam, Black &HD cork, and Balsa and the carving steps that I use are all the same no matter what type of mateial I'm carving. What changes is the tools needed to carve a particular medium and the materials needed to finish the decoy to a degree of service. My point is that there are more things to consider than just wood, cork, foam or what ever.


Your question was what is the best material for a beginner given that you have a limited amout of tools and my answer would be HD Cork. However as pointed out if you can find another material cheaper or for free then that has to be another factor. I think it is also important for beginning carvers to learn how to figure the Bd Foot price of the material they are considering to see if they are really getting a bargan. A 4x24x36 sheet of HD cork retails at $86 and that figures out to $3.58 a bd foot. If you add $20 shipping to that it comes out to $4.42 a bd ft. I know that Cedar and Basswood are retailing $5 and over and forget the price on Tupelo. I've never figured the BD Ft price on foam. Carving your own decoys is not a cheap hobby so the financial aspect has to be a factor beyond the ease of carving. My two cents.


In a nutshell....I love to carve wood as well as cork but prefer cork for beginning students to learn the steps.


Willy
 
You should also be on the look out for small local mills. I bought some pine for $1.00 per board foot. The operator/owner even cut it to size to my specifications.

When someone says wood is cheaper, they are likely referring to a local mill, not a store.

If you buy cork, go with the tan. It is less work to make durable.
 
Seriously? $5 a foot for bass wood or cedar? The last 1,00o foot or so of cedar I have bought cost me $1.55 a board foot and after I culled out what I didn't want to carve, my usable clear stock I was left with and fuel to get it ended up averaging out to around $2.25 (kiln dried), and I don't think that was any kind of screaming deal either. I imagine where you are at Jeff you should be able to find similar or better pricing.
 
Seriously? $5 a foot for bass wood or cedar? The last 1,00o foot or so of cedar I have bought cost me $1.55 a board foot and after I culled out what I didn't want to carve, my usable clear stock I was left with and fuel to get it ended up averaging out to around $2.25 (kiln dried), and I don't think that was any kind of screaming deal either. I imagine where you are at Jeff you should be able to find similar or better pricing.
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You may may not know this Paul, since he isn't a sponsor of any sort here and seldom posts, but Willy is cork retailer.
 
I don't know about cork pricing, but I do know that I can get cedar or white pine pretty cheaply.

At this point, for my first couple of decoys, I'm not really concerned with the raw price of the materials, but with being able to get started with minimal investment in tools and turn out a few blocks to see if I enjoy this and have enough skill to make usable blocks.

If I get into this, in all likelihood I'll end up carving cedar and/or pine--I really do like the local connection, and setting out cedar blocks a mile from home in a shore "blind" where my cover is natural cedar would be really cool.

For now, though, I just want to get started on a block or two this winter in between home repair and boat maintenance projects that aren't leaving me a lot of money for new tools, especially power tools.

(I did see a wicked nice Lie Nielsen draw knife the other day. I also like the idea of buying tools from a local tool maker, but I think the draw knife was over $200. Yikes.)
 
I don't know about cork pricing, but I do know that I can get cedar or white pine pretty cheaply.

At this point, for my first couple of decoys, I'm not really concerned with the raw price of the materials, but with being able to get started with minimal investment in tools and turn out a few blocks to see if I enjoy this and have enough skill to make usable blocks.

If I get into this, in all likelihood I'll end up carving cedar and/or pine--I really do like the local connection, and setting out cedar blocks a mile from home in a shore "blind" where my cover is natural cedar would be really cool.

For now, though, I just want to get started on a block or two this winter in between home repair and boat maintenance projects that aren't leaving me a lot of money for new tools, especially power tools.

(I did see a wicked nice Lie Nielsen draw knife the other day. I also like the idea of buying tools from a local tool maker, but I think the draw knife was over $200. Yikes.)
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Find someone local. Use at least their saw. There are probably 10 of us in New England that you could bum saw time off for nothing more than a warning to clean the shop ahead of time.
 
Seriously? $5 a foot for bass wood or cedar? The last 1,00o foot or so of cedar I have bought cost me $1.55 a board foot and after I culled out what I didn't want to carve, my usable clear stock I was left with and fuel to get it ended up averaging out to around $2.25 (kiln dried), and I don't think that was any kind of screaming deal either. I imagine where you are at Jeff you should be able to find similar or better pricing.
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Willy is spot on just bought some cedar locally $5 per board foot is right about what I paid. Priced out some basswood locally and that was the going price as well. Havent been carving all that long about a year but I am shocked at where the price of all woods have gone.
 
Yes I am a cork retailer but I still like cork as a teaching medium and the price of wood is at the retail level. If you do a little checking you can usally find a saw mill in your area and buy wholesale. Free is even better. Try Woodfinder.com to see what is available in your area.

Willy
 
The last time I bought KD white pine from a local mill (about a year and a half ago) it was around $2 a board foot, which was a little higher than I had previously paid.

The cedar I found cost me around 33 cents a board foot to get milled. I was told that’s a little on the high side, but I was more than happy to pay it (especially considering that he got all set up to cut two logs).
 
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Willy is a heck of a guy and has no more agenda than any other poster on this site. He is a very good source to buy stuff to work on decoys just as Lou is. I have learned a lot from them both and have used some of both guys product.
In the retail world, service and time is worth something. Unless you are a Walmart customer.
Both can help with info about decoys, and do.

I still like Cedar if you can find it. Buy the hand tools at a flea market and find someone to help sharpen them.

Bob
 
Hi Jeff. There is a big saw mill in Albany Vt that specialises in white cedar. Don't fool around with Red Cedar, its considerably harder. The woman that runs it lets you pick through the piles of timbers to select the one you like IF you put it all back together neatly. I think I paid 95 cents a board foot. As Tod said there are many carvers in New England who would let you have some band saw time, myself included. If you were to go to the trouble of driving to Vt for wood, you might as well allocate an additional day to come over and we can saw some of them up into carvable blocks.

John Bourbon
 
Jeff,

I have been carving a long time both cedar and cork. Your tools at the end of the day should not cost a lot. My best drawknive and spokeshave are both flea market specials. I'm very good friends with Willy and have no problem with his point on cork it can be easier when you start but cedar is by far my favorite and I feel that it holds up better in the long run. The cost in tools for either are going to be about the same. With you in Maine go with cedar and have fun. If you need the use of a bandsaw and some help cutting out a few birds let me know my shop is always open. I'm on Plum Island in Newburyport so short drive over the big green bridge. Hank
 
Thank you to all of you, and especially to the New England folks who have offered use of their tools. This place really is amazing.

I'm waiting for a used copy of Grayson Chesser's book I ordered, and will then do some research over in the carvers corner. Will hopefully have a plan and tools pulled together by mid winter.

Meanwhile, keep me in mind if you hear of any northern New England classes coming up.
 
Just a thought for you Jeff.... I find that it really isn't all that hard to carve something that looks like a duck but to paint it that way is a whole different story. LOL I am definitely better with tools than a paint brush.

I have worked with various woods but never cork. I like wooden things; they have a life of their own.
 
My turn to stir...

Meanwhile, keep me in mind if you hear of any northern New England classes coming up.
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Jeff

You have asked this twice now...besides just getting over to someone's shop, I do know that Steve Bretell has carving classes from time to time. I think Nate Grace knows Steve and would likely know if he is planning anything.

BTW I HATE CEDAR!!! just had a reaffirmation last night trying to get a swan head cut out without a knot or pith running through it. Worse than heads, try and get a long straight upright neck out of it (my necks are longer then the internodes)...what a waste. I'm interested in trying White Pine, but otherwise will stick to basswood. Without digging up a range map, do you have Northern White Cedar or Atlantic Juniper (which is what the central coast folk refer to as "cedar")? Good clear cedar is hard to come by, just the nature of the tree species. Cheap and free wood are great, but if the headaches of the medium make you not enjoy carving, then that isn't a very good choice for a hobby.

Frankly, I like many aspects of cork...the rough texture of the finish deek, the way it works, consistancy of material, and the way you can utilize material as well (don't have to worry about grain direction). The strongest arguement for Cedar in Jeff's case is the cost. The biggest drawback to cork is shipping and paying retail price...unless you want ot buy in a container or at leat a pallet, you are stuck paying retail...if only you could take a drive to timber country and find a cork mill, you could get an equally good deal on cork as local cedar...as it is we are stuck with just a few choices of where to purchase cork, and without healthy price competition...

I haven;t carved but one all cork body in the last 3 years, but miss it, and am itching to make a rig of BSC coot this summer.

Chuck
 
Willy, don't forget a nice bar of Ivory soap works real well for practicing! hehehhehe
Use what is most readily available for you in YOUR area, or use what is most within your comfort zone.
Started with simple tools and sugar pine, went to bsc, then to tan cork and have begun using cedar, sugar pine, to hollow dekes, balsa and cork!
 
[font=Verdana,Arial,Helvetica]Without digging up a range map, do you have Northern White Cedar or Atlantic Juniper (which is what the central coast folk refer to as "cedar")?

[/font][font=Verdana,Arial,Helvetica]We are at the far northern edge of Atlantic Juniper (assuming that's the same tree I know as Atlantic white cedar). But it would be northern white cedar I could either get commercially or find where I could cut it.

Question--how suitable is driftwood for carving? One of my brook trout lakes has an old stand of cedar that was flooded out when a dam was installed, and we've been taking a tree or two that's fallen over and washed ashore for easily processed firewood for years. I suspect I could scavenge some pretty easily, but it's been dead 50+ years and is bleached out and dried till the trunks are white.
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Jeff, you're right, it is commonly called Atlantic white cedar, of the genius Chamaecyparis, as opposed to NOrthern White Cedae, of the genus Thuja...

I think I wouldn't bother with driftwood...now submirged salvage timber, that would be different.

Chuck
 
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