Benelli M90 misfire in cold weather

M

Mike Perry

Member
Hunting in Ark. yesterday in tough conditions. Temp less than 20. Wind at 30. Mix of heavy snow and sleet.
First shot easy crossing on a drake mallard, missed.
Second on a drake again setting in the decoys, hit!
Next group of spoonbills settled in the decoys at 25 yards. I'm going to get an easy double, maybe a triple.
CLICK!!!!!!!
Checked the bolt all the way forward. Yes.
Checked the shell, no dent on the primer.
Jacked a new shell in and test fired. Click again.
Field diagnosed as broken firing pin.
Got a spare gun, no more opps.
Home today and with a new firing pin and spring. Just for kicks put in 3 2 3/4" dove loads and they all fired. Retest, good again.
Guy in the gun shop yesterday told me that on the Benellis a piece of grit or grass or whatever can get in the channel that the firing pin rides in and interrupts the full stroke.
So I surmise that I got some precipitation in the trigger mechanism due the the harsh conditions of yesterday.
Now the question. When I go to Kansas in a couple weeks, it is subject to be real cold again. We will be hunting the Arkansas river. To avoid a mishap again, what are recommendations for avoiding the same circumstances?
I have had this gun for over 10 years. Hunted from far north Alberta to Argentina. When I shoot, things usually fall out of the sky. Never had an issue with it till yesterday.
Suggestions????
 
I had a Benelli that misbehaved in a similar way a few years ago but only in very cold weather. The gunsmith I took it to immediately asked what oil I was using. He told me that the thickness of the oil will cause issues in very cold weather. On his recommendation I switched to G96 and never had another issue. (might be coincidence but I do like the G96 )
 
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When in really cold wet conditions I have had the same issue, and if a soaking wet dog rubs across the action of the gun after a retrieve I have had the whole action freeze up with a thin layer of ice. My new SBE has an over sized charging handle so I can rack the gun faster in these situations. I also second using an oil like G96 that will not freeze as I have seen perfectly clean guns in low temp situations that will not fire because the pin is frozen.
 
My son has had the problem with a Nova. Cold weather in reasesmthe visocity of the oil and slows the firing pin and Spring isn't strong enough to overcoming the thick oil.
 
Similar problem reported with Super Vinci on Duck Hunting Chat shotgun forum today. Lube is viewed as culprit, also moisture

http://www.duckhuntingchat.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=830586
 
I'd bet that the oil got thick or you had a little moisture in there that froze. I had that happen on a rifle, very frustrating.
You can run inertia guns fairly dry of lube. This helps not only keep anything from gumming up in the cold but also keeps things from sticking to the lube that is in the gun.

I tried the Berkebile lanolin based lube this year and was pretty happy with it. Didn't seem to slow the gun down in cold weather and didn't pick up too much grime and grit. Just make sure and wipe most of it off. The coldest day I hunted was about 12 by the end of the day.

Tim
 
Mike, benelli uses a spring, located in a tube housed in the stock for many of their guns. It costs about 10 bucks for the replacement and there are instructions for replacement on the web. It needs to be replaced occasionally depending on the number of rounds fired. A stronger spring is also a available as an alternative. Supposedly to increase cycle times, but I've ordered one to combat the same issue you are dealing with. The stronger spring can have negative consequences when shooting lighter loads, but for duck loads in cold weather, I think it will help. No matter my cleaning and light oiling( including blowing excess oil off with compressed air) techniques the oil becomes less. Is ours and I'll get a single shot shotgun when temps dip. If you are patient enough. I'll tell you how it works at the end of next season.
 
Ive used the same SBE for 14 years. Have shot it many times in below zero weather, and encased in ice.
They are sensitive to lube. Anything with Teflon, like Remoil is out. Breakfree works real well.
The spring in the stock could be worn. Not hard to to replace once you figure out how to get the lock tite loose. I replaced mine with a Wolf Spring, the heavier one, and it still shoots target loads just fine.
What you described sounds like what my gun just did last week. It turned out to have a buildup of carbon in the bolt, where the firing pin goes through. Couldnt see it, but once I cleaned it, no more problems. I soaked it in solvent, and used a really small allen wrench to break everything loose.
 
Had the same thing happen more than once. More often that not, it is the recoil spring in the stock of the gun. If you have never cleaned it, nor replaced it, I would do this first. When you get the new spring, you will be amazed at the difference in length of the new verse the old. You will wonder if you got the right replacement part it is that much of a difference.


As someone else mentioned, be careful removing the bolt on the recoil tube. It can be a bugger and you can easily ruin the gun if you crank on it.


Mark W
 
Had the same thing happen more than once. More often that not, it is the recoil spring in the stock of the gun. If you have never cleaned it, nor replaced it, I would do this first. When you get the new spring, you will be amazed at the difference in length of the new verse the old. You will wonder if you got the right replacement part it is that much of a difference.


As someone else mentioned, be careful removing the bolt on the recoil tube. It can be a bugger and you can easily ruin the gun if you crank on it.


Mark W
Click to expand...

Yes, it has red Loctite. Bolt needs some heat and then it spins right off.
 
My M1 has always worked slower than my old 1100 3 inch mag in very cold weather. It's the nature of the design in my opinion even if everything is A-OK. I had both guns for long times, and each was/is well maintained. Oil, grease,fouling and moisture are not good for any type of shotgun in very cold weather. In extreme cold it does not take much for them to not go Bang every once in awhile. How well the gun is mounted and against your shoulder with all the layers of clothing also plays a role. All part of the challenge of cold weather waterfowling.
 
If cleaned properly and lubed very spareingly with breakfree should work w out problem. Recoil spring in buttstock is other issue that will shut them down. Pull spring , clean spring and inside tube with bore cleaner. Very lightly lube and blow off excess w air.Spring can be stretched to function a while longer before reinstalling. If spring has never been removed before nut will be loctited. Heat w hot hairdryer to release loctite. Dont reinstall w loctite. Do my m2 about every 2 years just for good measure but have never had it fail. Exact same internals as your gun.
 
If cleaned properly and lubed very spareingly with breakfree should work w out problem. Recoil spring in buttstock is other issue that will shut them down. Pull spring , clean spring and inside tube with bore cleaner. Very lightly lube and blow off excess w air.Spring can be stretched to function a while longer before reinstalling. If spring has never been removed before nut will be loctited. Heat w hot hairdryer to release loctite. Dont reinstall w loctite. Do my m2 about every 2 years just for good measure but have never had it fail. Exact same internals as your gun.
Click to expand...

I always reinstall with red Loctite. The reason being you really don't want the end of the tube to unscrew when you remove the stock nut - that would be tough to fix.
 
We were comparing Benelli and Berretta stock issues in the blind on our last hunt this year.

My only complaint about my Beretta 3901--and the 390 before that, which was essentially the same gun--is what a PITA is is to remove the stock and especially to clean the recoil tube and spring.

There is a spacer that need to be fitted properly inside the stock, too far inside to place with fingers at a spot too narrow to use your hands anyway. Then there is a washer and nut that need to be placed on a bolt, also just far enough inside the stock to preclude using your fingers to place them.

My cleaning kit therefore contains a long reach socket wrench, an extendable magnet to place the metal parts, and a long stick to knock those parts off the magnet. (This is pretty straight forward with the spacer, but requires three hands with the washer.) All of this needs to be done while also holding the receiver and the stock to keep them from moving while the spacer, washer and nut are placed.

That's just the stock. The magazine tube suffers the same issues discussed above about Benellis, and even after heating the loctite, removing it requires holding the stock while attempting to apply a lot of torque with a very small wrench on a small round spindle that is flattened on two sides to receive a wrench.

It's a miserable job, but cleaning and lubing that tube makes a big difference in cycling, especially in very cold weather.

My buddy and I agreed this design was a permanent employment program for gunsmiths. It's so frustrating to do that the average user will never clean the recoil tube and spring, ensuring that they need to visit a gunsmith at least every few years.
 
Have owned a beretta 303 years ago and 391 optima a few years ago . As far as being great guns they were but your right they are pains in the arse to disasemble. Remingtons and brownings were much easier in that dept. Both the m2 and a prior SBE much easier to clean but thankfully not needed as much.
 
Agreed Roy, but there is a screwy little metal part that fits into the receiver of my 1187 that is also a complete PITA . . . . not to mention those damn O-rings in the gas system. I am told the 1100's were easier to deal with.

Haven't had a Browning, so can't say.

As cleaning and maintenance go, there is a lot to be said for OU's and SxS's. Pumps, too, if you like that third shot. My OU is too pretty to take out in salt water and mud, so it is saved for woodcock and the occasional freshwater rail hunt, but I am constantly on the look-out for a nice beater used OU choked IC and MOD for ducks over decoys.
 
Sometimes it is more than loctite holding the recoil tube nut - sometimes it has corrosion associated with it being difficult to remove. Care to ask how I know this?

I now reassemble that nut with antiseize. Reading Tod's comment, I hope this wasn't a mistake.

Mark W
 
We were comparing Benelli and Berretta stock issues in the blind on our last hunt this year.

My only complaint about my Beretta 3901--and the 390 before that, which was essentially the same gun--is what a PITA is is to remove the stock and especially to clean the recoil tube and spring.

There is a spacer that need to be fitted properly inside the stock, too far inside to place with fingers at a spot too narrow to use your hands anyway. Then there is a washer and nut that need to be placed on a bolt, also just far enough inside the stock to preclude using your fingers to place them.

My cleaning kit therefore contains a long reach socket wrench, an extendable magnet to place the metal parts, and a long stick to knock those parts off the magnet. (This is pretty straight forward with the spacer, but requires three hands with the washer.) All of this needs to be done while also holding the receiver and the stock to keep them from moving while the spacer, washer and nut are placed.

That's just the stock. The magazine tube suffers the same issues discussed above about Benellis, and even after heating the loctite, removing it requires holding the stock while attempting to apply a lot of torque with a very small wrench on a small round spindle that is flattened on two sides to receive a wrench.

It's a miserable job, but cleaning and lubing that tube makes a big difference in cycling, especially in very cold weather.

My buddy and I agreed this design was a permanent employment program for gunsmiths. It's so frustrating to do that the average user will never clean the recoil tube and spring, ensuring that they need to visit a gunsmith at least every few years.
Click to expand...

Sound like you have the tools and skill - have up a shingle - Benelli/Beretta recoil spring repair.
 
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