Best dog book

Paul Meisenheimer

Paul Meisenheimer

Well-known member
What book would you recommend for training a new lab? I have read some great posts from folks who really seem to have it figured out and would like to know what you suggest. I haven't brought a new pup into the house in over 20 years and need to start thinking about getting a good foundation in place from day one.
 
Water dog by Richard Wolters
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Sorry Jack, but I think that is the worst book to recommend to someone.

IMO there are a lot of good training programs out there today. I would do yourself a favor and get a video series. A lot of things are easier to understand if you visualize them. The two most popular are the Lardy and Evan Grahm series. These can get pretty expensive. For a slightly cheaper solution, I would start with Jackie Merten's Sound Beginnings for puppy training. As you advance, I really like the Fowl Dog series by Rick Stawski.

Also, find a training group. It will make things more enjoyable and experience people can help you work through problems.

Good Luck,
James
 
I thought "Water Dog" by Wollner (or Wolters or ?) was good but the time table was way to aggressive for my tastes and my chessie's. I tried to keep to the schedule that he outlines but just couldn't keep up. Just remember, every dog matures at a different rate so watch your dog for signs that he is ready for the next step.

There are a lot of good reads out there so head to the library and read several.
 
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Wolters still works for basic duck dogs, as does the book "training your retriever for field and marsh". Both provide a solid foundation for a usable working dog.

The training materials from Lardy go beyond Wolters and into high quality handling of blind retrieves. A lot of the semi pros up here use his stuff over all others and they get lots of letters behind their dogs names.

Evan Graham's Smart Work materials are very similar to Lardy's stuff. Being that they are spiral bound they are really handy for using in the field during a training session. But then you look like a fool to the other folks if you are group training. The only advantage that I see to Graham's stuff is that he has a huge internet following and is very active on the dog training forums. However, he is no where near as fun to talk dogs with as travis bruce is on this forum.

Many authors use the term "know your dog" when it comes to determining progress through their system. In two years I have figured out that "know your dog" really means that the author didn't want to write a 20 volume encylopedia to fully expain the highly varied responses that dogs have to the various situations you put them in during taining. To understand what "know your dog" means you have to train a few dogs and learn what the dogs are telling you through their reactions and behavior. If you don't understand what is causing them to do something you will have a hard time correcting for it and teaching them through their problem.

Or better yet work in the field with people that have successfully trained several dogs and observe what the dog and trainer do to work out problems. Leaving my pup in the truck and observing the pro help his other customers with their dogs taught me things Lardy and Graham cannot in any fashion publish on paper.
 
I did a little bit of both text and video. I liked Tom Dokken's Retriever Training (text), Gun Dog: Puppy Training - The Foundation of a Gun Dog (DVD) and the Fowl Dog (DVD) series. Tom Dokken's was very straight foward and detailed and had decent illustrations for a book. The gun dog dvd has a lot of simple stuff in it but important and I got it real cheap on-line. I only got to FF in the Fowl Dog Series before hunting season. It had very good information and they use a lot young new dogs that are also just learning so when the dog struggled he showed how to fix the problem.
 
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Many authors use the term "know your dog" when it comes to determining progress through their system. In two years I have figured out that "know your dog" really means that the author didn't want to write a 20 volume encyclopedia to fully explain the highly varied responses that dogs have to the various situations you put them in during training. To understand what "know your dog" means you have to train a few dogs and learn what the dogs are telling you through their reactions and behavior. If you don't understand what is causing them to do something you will have a hard time correcting for it and teaching them through their problem.

Or better yet work in the field with people that have successfully trained several dogs and observe what the dog and trainer do to work out problems. Leaving my pup in the truck and observing the pro help his other customers with their dogs taught me things Lardy and Graham cannot in any fashion publish on paper.
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Paul,

I have to agree with the point Ray brought up. Another analogy is the fella applying for a job; The ad says "must have experience" yet no one will hire you, so you can gain that experience.

Amateur owner/trainers are caught in the same catch 22; Not enough experience to do a first class job of training on the first dog or even their second dog. Too little actual experience and too long between dogs to really get good at and understand all that is needed to do a professional job.

Don't get me wrong, many a good working dog has been trained by their owners and I am in that group of owners so I understand some of the reasons for training one's own dog.

I have only used one book for reference and it served me well. I won't recommend any one particular book or author but would recommend that you do as much research and reading as you can. The best thing I can recommend is to be consistent in your training methods so that you do not confuse your dog. Don't be afraid to take it slower than a professional might.
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Paul,
here is a link to a copy of the Original Puppy Post from Travis.



http://duckboats.net/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=78935;search_string=puppy post;#78935


I like the program from Butch Goodwin who handles mostly Chessies but it works for any type. It is an online hosted program and the info is sound from start to finish for a hunting dog. Not trial or hunt test based but it makes a heck of a hunting dog. Can use or not use a collar with the program and that for some is a plus.

See his site at the link below. The training program is Retriever training from the inside out.

http://www.northernflight.com/

I know Phil has one of Butches dogs and I am sure he can comment further.

Lastly,
if you can find a dog person, Pro or Amateur who is good with dogs, do what ever you have to to hang out with them. You will learn a lot from osmosis.
If not, a video of a good trainer can help you to see some of the subtle things that make it easier to understand how to communicate with the dog.
I just got a used copy of a video done by Danny Farmer and Judy Aycock. She was a Rex Carr student, Danny went way far with his dogs in the Trials after working with her. Just watching them work a dog gives a lot of little things to keep in mind.
http://dannyfarmer.com/

Plan to make the time, because that is what is needed and then go easy if you are not sure. Get help where ever you can. Good luck.
 
Maybe I should give a little more information about what I am looking for.

I want to get through the first few months without messing up big time. I would consider hiring a trainer but really think I might like to try to do it myself. It is more important to me that I have a hunting buddy, family friend and blind mate than a hunting machine. There are certain behaviors I won't tolerate and I will work hard to eliminate them but believe me it is a short list. I will check out the area for training groups but having met a number of the individuals I am not entirely sure I want to subject myself to that let alone a dog.

I have hunted over many, many labs and most have been professionally trained. Of the professionally trained dogs not all were good hunting dogs and one I flat out refused to hunt over after the first outing. I can recall three that refused birds on different occasions and one that took off for home on foot. With this experience to draw on I am not all that enthused about some of the professional training results I have seen.

One dog that was not professionally trained was Tori. She was a yellow I owned many years ago. Tori was a "British" lab and had come out of "show" stock and had many ribbons of her own from the "conformation" show circuit. She came to live at my home when she was about a year and a half old. She had more issues than you could imagine and the simple goal was to have a good companion and house dog. Just messing around and having fun turned her into a half decent field dog. She would hunt great for me as long as there wasn't another dog in the blind or field. She would not work for anyone else. In both of those situations she just shut down. She was as stubborn as they come and had serious trust issues. My guess is that something upset her terribly in the puppy years. We worked things out between us and she enjoyed her years at my home. When I think of working retrievers and the best day I have ever had watching a dog work it is Tori that comes to mind. It was just the two of us in the blind and she was incredible that day.

I have owned a few dogs and handled many a trained dog. I have some limited experience working with professionals and amateurs who compete extensively. In every case it was with an older dog. I haven't had a puppy since I was a pup myself.
 
Paul,
I think you have a feel for what you want. I am pretty sure you can get there if you put in the work.
I would say you can help a lot by putting in the time on just who the two dogs are in the cross first, and then looking at the basics above.

Things like Quiet, not Breaking and Blind manners are all parts of a good hunting dog. If the parents can do it you should be able to get there yourself with the pup.
 
Paul,
I think you have a feel for what you want. I am pretty sure you can get there if you put in the work.
I would say you can help a lot by putting in the time on just who the two dogs are in the cross first, and then looking at the basics above.

Things like Quiet, not Breaking and Blind manners are all parts of a good hunting dog. If the parents can do it you should be able to get there yourself with the pup.
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Bob, those three points are important to me. Triple blinds over deadfalls and water in a trial is not a priority. The breeding is outstanding. The credentials of both parents are lengthy. Both are hunting dogs that have run trials and I am thrilled to hunt over either of them. This pup will not run trials. The bitch is owned by a friend with training and trial experience. He is always available to help. I think he may keep one pup and then I would have a training partner. That would be ideal.

I really appreciate all the feedback. Please keep it coming.

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Paul,
Well Holly be bi-lingual? I figured she would know how to retrieve in French and English! What a great looking pup.
Al
 
If you decide you want Evan Grahm series. I have the book and several of the videos new in the original packaging. Make an offer. I can't speak as to how good the series is but when I was looking for training videos his were suposed to be some of the best.
Good luck
 
Ten Minute Retriever - John & Amy Dahl

The Evan Graham training series

I have them all...and more.

I had your books for 8+ months and now you can have these.....permanent loan
 
SOUND BEGINNINGS Retriever training, Jackie Merten

SMART WORK Even Graham


Would be 2 worth looking at.
 
I'd recommend the Smart Works and Videos. Covers a lot of basics. I think most trainers don't want your dog until they are 6 months old and have a good grasp of basic OB
 
Paul,

The Ten-Minute Retriever is geared towards puppyhood and the first year or so of training. With it, I easily established a solid foundation.

For advanced training, I used Butch Goodwin's manual. I recommend it.

With my next pup, I plan to supplement the 10-Minute Retriever with a British manual like Bill S suggested. I want to produce calmness and steadiness w/o a heavy hand (speaking figuratively, of course). I think most current books/methods fail in this regard.

Good luck with whichever book you choose.
 
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