Best Retriever Training Books

Books are good, DVD's are better! Never really got good at training dogs till I started watching video (VHS back in the day) There are a lot of good ones out there, but my all time favorite is Dave Dikeman's command performance, it is a obedience tape but it is broken down so anyone can succeed at training a dog.

If your only wanting books at this time though I like
The Ten minute retriever by John & Amy Dahl
and
Smart work by Evan Graham

Good Luck with your journey !
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Well, I must say you've got the full cross section of what to do (or not do). The one thing that is rarely mentioned is that it doesn't make much difference what program, book or person's advice is used if you don't learn how to teach a pup what it's instincts are designed for.

One misconception I see crop up in threads like this is the idea that an e-collar is supposed to make a dog behave and perform. Nothing could be farther than the truth in that respect. Teaching is the key to retriever training. The e-collar can be lumped right in with a heeling stick, pinch or choker collar and a leash.

There is nothing wrong with treats early on, but real rewards are more effective. In addition, I'm fairly positive that once taught properly a dog needs to understand the reinforcement of consequences. Good habits established by teaching early on become a way of life. The key to this is to make sure the right way is all they know.

Books, DVDs, programs only show what is possible and may provide a sequence of things to work on. Retriever training is a process that falls apart if the focus is not on teaching. In addition, it is important to have good, consistent advice early on. Strive to enlist the aid of a TEACHING mentor.

My feeling about books is that old ones have old ideas. It's not that they don't work to some degree. It doesn't necessarily indicate old won't work, it's just that there are newer programs with ideas and techniques that are more effective.......if done correctly.

Fourteen years ago I read Milner's material and it wasn't for me. I started my first dog on Dobb's and soon moved on to using quite a bit of Graham and Lardy which are Rex Carr based programs. I do use an e-collar.

The mere mention of e-collar brings on controversy. There are few discussions in dog training that can top the emotional waves of the e-collar. My response to this is it is simply a tool and like any tool it must be used correctly. It does not teach.

Then again this is a thread where discussions of the e-collar will sidetrack the OP's intent.

There are several very useful, free articles written by Butch Goodwin. One of the newest approaches (recently presented by Bill Hillman) is receiving great responses. The driving principle is reward based on "the retrieve is the reward".

However, not much of what is used in developing a retriever will work very well if the trainer can't teach.

Initially, it is important to instill in a pup that you are the center of their universe. You don't get this early on by spending a great deal time making him do anything. Get a pup into thinking everything is fun and you are the source.

Trainers get in trouble when they become too preoccupied with trying to make a pup do what they want when in fact training should be based on doing what the pup needs "in the moment".

Here's a link which might provide some perspectives. It includes the daily journal entries for several months of a pup's early training.

http://kwicklabs.com/InTheMoment.htm
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There is some great advice here, Dave. Now it will be up to you to sort through it deciding what will be kept or discarded.

Jim Boyer made this statement that I think is paramount in ones start with a pup: "Initially, it is important to instill in a pup that you are the center of their universe. You don't get this early on by spending a great deal time making him do anything. Get a pup into thinking everything is fun and you are the source."

In essence, Dave, if you can, make sure that pup is in your arms as much as possible. Imprinting is vital. Good luck.
Al
 
The e collar can be a lightning rod in dog training discussions. There is a lot attributed to it that is false. It is only a tool. It is no more evil than any other coller and lead. Think of it as the leashless lead.

The advances in dog training educational aids have been tremendous in the past twemty years. Some have recommended some 'oldie but goodie' books. I think there are much better resources out there. I strarted with some of those books and am familiar with them. I would recommend starting with the 10-minute retriever by the Dahls or Sound beginnings by Jackie Mertens. Moving on there is Smartworks and Total Retriever Training.

Many people start out saying I only want a dog to retrieve by birds, I don't need all that 'fancy' stuff. The more advanced programs like Smartworks and TRT teach the basics in a way that builds to advanced work. They lay a foundation you can build on if you choose to. Starting out witha method that does not lay a foundation for advanced work will create barriers unnecessarily.

Let me use a duck boat example. Let's say you build a pond box to hunt out of so you can out a little farther into the marsh. As your interest grows you decide you want to hunt the rivers that border the marsh. But, your little homemade pond box is not suitable. What do you do? Do you just add a keel and transom? Or, do you start over with another boat? And then you want to hunt big, open water?

Start with a program that will allow you to advance in the future if you choose to. If you decide to stop at step number two that is fine.

And, all these programs can be done without the e collar if you choose to. The collar teaches nothing. The trainer is the one who teaches.

Have fun with your dog,

Tom
 
Water dog by wolters. 10 minute retriever is a little strange when he tells you to shoot your dog with ratguns, slingshots and pellet guns
 
Pat,
It's been a while since I read the book, can you tell me where they mention using slingshots or rat shot? If they do say to do that then I'll likely stop recommending the book. However, I know I never did any of that with Bailey, and don't remember reading it.

Scott
 
Been awhile since i read it too i,m going thru it now . But if you look the book up on amazon their is a review that say,s the same thing
 
I've had great luck with Game Dog (which is Water Dog plus a few upland drills) by Wolters for the foundation and the Fowl Dawgs DVD series by Rick Stawski which is especially good for force breaking and basic obedience. There are a million opinions and a million training systems but I think the most important thing is to pick one, stick with it, and be consistent in applying it.
 
Just had to respond on the notion that The 10-Minute Retriever encouraged or stood behind the use of ratguns, slingshots, etc. I have no "dog" in the argument of whose method is best. I will say that this book is well written and useful.

On page 180 of the book, John Dahl begins writing about a dog he formerly handled named Mitch. Throughout the book, there are anecdotal stories that relate to past dogs that John has worked with. He often relates the mistakes and lessons he learned through training the dog while being honest about a situation that was either his or the dogs shortcomings. In this anecdotal section about Mitch, "a young prospect with an overabundance of drive but limited brain power".

Page 181, bottom of page:
"Steadiness was another obstacle to surmount. In Mitch's mind, the sight of a bird or a dummy in the air was the signal to take off. We tried various methods to steady him, including the training stick, electric collar, short breaking cord, and so forth. Nothing seemed to delay his explosive departure the instant the retrieving object was sighted. It was difficult to teach marking to Mitch because he was so active on the line that precise marking was impossible.

Finally, we tried the last resort -- the rat pistol. This won't injure the dog when it is used more than ten yards away. It hurts, though, and will usually stop the breaking. The rat shot technique worked on Mitch. We don't recommend this method any more, as shooting too close can embed shot in your dog's skin. Worse, if your timing is bad, and your dog turns around, you can put out an eye. Many of the training techniques used 20 or 30 years ago have fallen into disuse because of their inherent risks."

I don't think he is supporting the thought of shooting your dog with a rat pistol or pepper your dog from a hundred yards away. I think he clearly admits that it was a practice that was used and accepted to some degree but not something that endorses.

Hopefully that will clear up this issue.

Chad
 
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There are those that bust on "Water Dog" , don't listen to them. I trained my 1st lab 20 years using the book and then my 2nd lab 7 years ago using the Water Dog DVD, and will start my new pup coming in July with it. The only thing I didn't do was introduce to gun fire over the food bowl, everything else worked as instructed. Water Dog, Game Dog & Top Dog are all available off the rack at Gander Mountain, Bass Pro and online.
I also have the Lardy collection, very good but maybe over the top depending on your goals. Chris Akin who runs in the SRS put out "Duck Dog Basics" DVD, really good. Look up his lab "Boomer".
There is lots of good info. All of the reference material will tell you to let the pup be a pup and be a kid. Don't push YOUR expectations down it's throat. Dogs are mans best friend and if you treat yours like your best friend he will do all he can to please you... and challenge you.
I heard a joke a long time ago that went something like, lock your lab and your wife in your car trunk for an hour and then when you open the trunk, see which one is happy to see you and licks you all over the face. Dogs have an undying love.... sorry, I digress.
 
Pat,
Yep, I found it. That was disappointing as I have a pretty high opinion of their approach. Since I had a collar, I guess I read right over that comment. Thanks!

Scott
 
Pat,
Yep, I found it. That was disappointing as I have a pretty high opinion of their approach. Since I had a collar, I guess I read right over that comment. Thanks!

Scott
Click to expand...

the exerpt is taken from a incident on a particular dog which occurred 30 years ago.... The context of it( as I read it) was to show how methods have changed and evolved
 
Geez sorry i got you so aggravated Dave . Nothing was read wrong , He says he LIKES to use a slingshot and pellet gun . the book i have was published in 2001 shy of 30 years. No particular dog was mentioned just dogs in general.You might be referring to the ratgun he used to use. But the writing say nothing about what they did,or use to do he is telling you what he likes to do.
 
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