Canoes: Which to buy?

ksherbine

Active member
I'm looking at upgrading my canoe from my old Coleman to something a little lighter and more stable. Any suggestions?

It would mainly be used for hunting small swamps and places where it's too far to drag our sneakboxes, but I'd also like something I wouldn't be afraid to take the kids (maybe one at a time) out either on the lake or some easy rivers with.

I've looked a little at the Old Towne Packs, and the Sportspal 12'ers. I like that light weight, but I'm not sure what all you give up with that short length. I've never paddled a short canoe before.

Also, how do the Sportspal and Old Towne's compare in general?

Thanks,
 
Kirk
Too bad you aren't closer. I have a 17ft Core Craft canoe (60 lbs) with 1 1/2 hp motor and a sail and trailer for sale. It has closed deck fore and aft and with triple keels. I've hunted and fished out of it and it is probably the most stable canoe that I have owned. Age has caught up to me so a canoe just isn't in my program anymore.
wis boz
 
Kirk - I'm a big fan of Old Towne for their durability and functionality. I own a Old Towne Predator SS150. It can hold 3 people, has a weight capacity of 850lbs and runs a 5hp. When I served in Boy Scouts, we took a white water canoe trek in North Central Wisconsin. We canoed both the Flambeau and Brule Rivers. If you've never canoed Wisconsin before, they have enormous rocks! These canoes took a major beating but performed and held up in a big way. While you'll pay a little more for an Old Towne, it is worth the money...
 
Kirk,

Not sure how serious about canoe performance, but here goes...in a general way

Hull shape

Rocker ---the less rocker you have the harder it is to slide the canoe sideways (by paddling) to avoid objects...the greater the rocker the better for whitewater and rivers......touring canoes generally have minimal rocker.


Symmetrical (S) verses Asymmetrical (AS) ---AS canoes are great for lakes and touring, they are also faster hulls then S hulls and might track straighter. Whitewater canoes are S. Some S hulls are are for general purpose and may be paddled so that once was aft is now forward.


Shorter hulls generally turn easy but track poorly...longer hulls track better...

There are other hull parameters that also determine performance but the above are a good place to start.

I would define how you are going to use the canoe and go from there...but if it were me I would buy a 15-16 foot symmetrical canoe with even rocker fore and aft of about 1.5-2 inches.....I have a Dagger Legend that is 16 feet, symmetrical, and 2 inches of rocker...I have taken it down rivers like the Henry's Fork of the snake (Box Canyon) and Salmon in central Idaho, used it on lakes and in general beat the crap out of it.... While it is not the lightest or fastest canoe (68lbs RoyalX Hull) it is tough and has served me well...

Heck I even stand up and pole it across the marshes of the Great Salt Lake so it is stable enough..


My 2.5 pennies worth
 
I really like Sportspals. I would definitely reccomend them over aluminim or fiberglass.
They are light, stable and very quiet with that foam in the floor.

I have hunted out of several. I sold a fiberglass canoe that I had and intended to buy a sportspal but just never manage to call quickly enough on ones in the classifieds.

The old ones seem sturdier than the Radison ones that they sell at Gander Mart.
 
Kirk,

The things Matt mentioned are definitely true and there is one other point to add and that is stability. Initial stability and secondary stability will come instantly to mind when you climb in and start to paddle. Initial stability is the feeling you get first, how solid the boat feels in the water. Aluminum canoes, by their method of manufacture have a flatter bottom/hull shape. That tends to feel more stable, but if you tip them too far you're gonna take a swim. Secondary stability usually refers to a rounder bottom/hull shape, where they will tip farther and come back without going over, but they "feel tippier". Sorry, none of us can tell you what to buy. You need to TRY before you BUY. Find what's comfortable for you. I hunted out of a 17' Grumman canoe for 20 some years and I've been wet a few times. ;^) It's tollerable in Oct. NOT FUN in Dec.

my $.005

George
 
Kirk, Take a look at Ron Chapman-Piroques,I have the King model,almost 16 ft long,I brought it back from Louisiana when I was down there working Katrina storm damage,I take my boy fishing in all the time real stable boat,all fiberglass with cypress rub rails,its about 60-70 lbs,hope this helps Brian Rippelmeyer
 
As far as stability goes, I absolutely love my 14" Sportspal. The only drawback is some of the swamps we hunt have narrow channels in the grass and reeds to get through and its width is sometimes an issue. Other than that I love it.
 
Thanks guys. I'll look into the ones you listed.

Chris- How is the Sportspal to paddle? Does it scoot pretty well, like a more narrow canoe, or is it more along the lines of rowing a boat?

I assume you're talking about the swamps around Pymatuning? I know what you mean about narrow channels. I had a borrowed set of those pontoons that bolt across the gunnels of the canoe and then crank down on arms last year, and got them hung up in the brush 4-5 times.
 
If you want canoe review overload check out www.paddling.net
There is even a classified section. I don't think there is much on Sportspals/Raddisons there though. A lot of people I know swear by them up here in the Adirondacks for fishing and hunting. (Sportspals/Raddisons) They mostly row them around here I've noticed.
Good luck.
-
 
Kirk:

It really depends on how you are going to use it. If you want an all-around canoe that you can use on anything from Class III whitewater to paddling across a whitecapped lake, that you can use solo or with a partner, that will paddle well with just you or be able to handle a load for a week long trip, take Matt's advice.

The Dagger Legend is one great all around canoe. Two others that get rave reviews are the Mad River Explorer (16 feet) and the Old Town Tripper (17 feet). I'm sure there are others, but those are the three I see in most in New England. (In the Midwest, especially around the Boundary Waters, you'll see more of a premium on canoes for flatwater, and they'll be a little longer, a little narrower, and a little flatter.) If you can get across the border into Canada, look at the Nova Craft Prospector in 16 or 17 foot lengths.

Any of these will carry you and a buddy, 2 dozen decoys, a retriever and the rest of your gear. I use my Mad River Explorer, which has now seen at least 20 years of hard use, even on protected tidal waters in Maine, right to the close of the season in late December. I've never felt unsafe. I'd be equally comfortable in any similar canoe.

Little canoes like the Old Town Pack or the Sportspal are a lot easier to carry, but have a lot smaller capacity, and don't paddle nearly so well. If you are solo, only need to go a short distance on flat water with no waves, and don't need to carry as much gear, they may be a better choice than a canoe that is bigger than you need. They are a LOT easier to hide.

If I can give a single piece of advice, and its one that will conflict with much that you will hear about "hunting" or "sporting" canoes, it's to not buy something with a keel. It won't really help the boat track better (although other boat design features will). I'd also avoid flat-bottomed canoes--which are also commonly marketed to the sporting crowd for their "stability". A flat bottomed canoe will FEEL more stable than a boat with an arched or a V-hull. However, a good V or arched hull will get more stable the farther you lean it. (Up to a point, of course. Once your center of mass is outside the gunwales, all best are off.) A flat bottomed boat will feel stable at first, but as you lean (say, to pick up a decoy or haul your Lab back in the boat) it will pass the tipping point rapidly and become less stable. That's when you swim. This tendency is even more pronounced in short canoes than in longer ones.
 
Jeff,,

If I feel a tad crazy...add air bags (flotation) fore and aft....and tackle even a bit of class 4...but I have to feel crazy...
 
Kirk,

Make some type of silhouette decoys out of the Coleman canoe hull...get a better boat and more decoys....
 
Jeff,,

If I feel a tad crazy...add air bags (flotation) fore and aft....and tackle even a bit of class 4...but I have to feel crazy...


With the Dagger you can get away with that. I wouldn't try it in an Explorer or a Tripper. Maybe the 17 foot Prospector, but only by a paddler with better skills than me.

I once watched a woman solo a Dagger Legend through the Cribworks, a Class V drop on the West Branch Penobscot in Maine. She had it rigged with a pedastal kneeling stand, leg straps, float bags, etc. She made it through the most difficult part of the drop, but just got completely swallowed by a big standing wave at the bottom. She went in at the top, disappeared, and about 10 seconds later the boat popped up in an eddy on one shore and she popped up on the other side.

It was scary to watch, but she just hopped back in the boat after a kayaker ferried her over to it.
 
Jeff

Sounds like a gutsy women....

I have seen Legends do the Middle Fork of the Salmon...at moderate flows....I gave up a Middle Fork permit one Sept as the buddy that was going along in another Legend ended up having knee surgery...Sept water on the Middle Fork is not to crazy....So one of these years I will do the Main Salmon from Corn Creek down to Riggins in October or get a permit on the Middle Fork...time it right and you can hunt chukars....Middle Fork has cuts....have to stop working so much....
 
Sweetest canoe I ever owned was a MadRiver Duck Hunter edition. 17' feet long and 76 lbs. Hunted that thing for 16 years. Could carry a ton of equipment and never flipped it the whole time I hunted out of it.

MadRiver used to also make a "specialty" canoe that was shorter than the Duck Hunter and a lot wider too. Can't for the life of me remember what they called it. It even came in a nice camo pattern too.

Check out this link and do some reading from their website. http://www.madrivercanoe.com/product_subcategory/index/products/sporting/angler_duck_hunter/

You can't go wrong with a MadRiver.

Grace and peace!

David
 
It rows and turns easily, not quite as quick on the turns as by buddies 14' old towne, but 1000 times more stable. The only time I prefer to take his is when we are hitting the swamps. Yep I am talking Pymy.
 
If I didn't already have a grumman sportboat, I would add a square stearn SCOTT canoe. Lightweight and very stable. You buy something like this and own it for 30 years. Makes the investment worth the price
 
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