Canvas decoys

mike braden

mike braden

Well-known member
I was bitten by the canvas big sometime ago. I was fortunate to have one of the best canvas guys in the country 20 minutes from me (Rob Oliver). Because Rob is involved in a lot of cool competitions along the east coast, it was only natural for me to follow. If you really want to make better decoys, start entering them into competitions. View attachment 3389484D-52AB-453A-A69C-4E3572802482.jpegView attachment 2D493B6E-64E5-41A5-8B55-773B03475CBB.jpegView attachment 37CE20F1-D7A0-43F6-BF3B-CA8BFD2269BD.jpegView attachment DCACF8E8-68D0-4595-A0A9-F6819B440418.jpeg
 
All~


Mike - and Rob Oliver - graced our 2018 Contemporary Decoy Exhibition with a flock of canvas birds. Here's Mike's Black Duck:


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I think many gunners (and judges) do not appreciate how tough painted canvas is. I am glad to see this traditional "technology" spreading northward....global warming?...or invasive species?



All the best,


SJS

 
Carl - In due time I will. For now, I've been doing them for competitions. If my mentor Rob was not into the competition so much, I probably wouldn't be either. But, I'm glad to be doing it. I really look forward to the shows.

Chuck - Thank you. It was your original post on here with your canvas decoys that inspired me to go the canvas route. I have been making some cork as of late but I really want to get back to the canvas decoys.

Steve - Thanks for the pic. Let me know the specifics of the LI show this year
 
Nice work. Did you compete at the Strongsville show?
Remember back in the early ninties competing in the Pool Contest at ODCCA in Westlake with canvas birds. Me and Vince Pagliaroli among others.
good times.
Ken Yacavone
 
My mentor Rob Oliver got started in canvas a short time ago and he has progressed rather quickly. He was making some wood and cork stuff but really wasn?t getting better. He was talking to a guy (I forget who) at a show and they told him to try something different. A short time later he was reading an issue of wildfowl carving magazine and they had an article on canvas decoys so he decided to give it a try. About halfway through his first decoy he stopped because he realized that he could do better and each of his canvas decoys continues to get better and better. His biggest kick is when he enters a canvas in a contemporary category and he beats the wood decoys.
 

Archie Johnson was a regular vendor, and member of the ODCCA for many years. He knows canvas decoys like few others do.

I spent many hours with him, and his wife, listening and learning. Sitting at the foot of a Master. He gave me hell cuz I used gesso on my canvas decoys. Who was I to disagree?


Major recognition for contests for Canvas Decoys began at "The POOL" at the ODCCA show at Westlake, Ohio. Thanks to Mr, Clif Kastil.


IF you make Contest Canvas Decoys. YOU owe Mr. Kastil ,and the ODCCA, a huge debt of gratitude, and should do so ASAP

Before he recognized the gunning use of canvas decoys, few if any contests gave a damn. He was The Point Man, and yes he did take lots of flak.


Contest canvas decoys have morphed from the simple, to to complex. The absolute reverse of their intent.

The true test of canvas decoys are simplicity, and USE, as gunning decoys.


This is a canvas/wire Tundra Swan, Archie Johnson's son Johnny made, and that we gunned over at Chincoteague, VA. in the 1980's. I was one of several in the rig. Sorry for the poor photo.

Note the simplicity, and the number of wires, and no cork, or extra wood, fore or aft, or anywhere else. This decoy never saw a contest. It saw hard work, and may in fact now be extinct.

That was it's sole purpose. To WORK, and do a damn fine JOB, and it did.


I am Old School/Geezer, and for that do not apologize.

If I am in today's world "Throwing shade", well then, it is what it is.


For the old school, East Coast wire/canvas decoy makers, less was more. Wood, a few wires,stringers (maybe), canvas and Simple paint. Disposable decoys, not made to last, but made to WORK.


View attachment swan.jpg


This post is not to Discourage, but to Encourage ALL canvas decoys makers, to study the genre, and it's place in North American Waterfowling History.

If contests are it's future, than so be it.


Best regards
VP
 
I did not realize how big a proponent of the canvas division Cliff was when I started going to The Ohio Decoy show, he is true friend of the decoy seamstress! I enjoyed the pool, I enjoyed hanging with a bunch of guys you wouldn't otherwise meet, talking about common interests, sharing techniques, and otherwise passing the time on a Sunday in the late winter. A great cure for cabin fever! (heck, I met Vince poolside at Westlake...enough said!)

I'm not quite the purist of Vince, I do put some cork in the breast of most of my deeks. But I have to say one of my proudest contestant moments was being judged first loser:



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I feel no shame coming in second to George Williams.

But Vince is right, hunting over your own decoys is another feeling altogether:



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Get them out there Mike, that is what it is all about!

Keep up the good work!

Best
Chuck
 
Chuck -

Your body booters set up is something you don't see much of these days. Talk about Old School, dats it! [smile]


Best regards
VP
 
Quick Story

Last year at the Rappahannock Show, my wife and I were at the hotel having breakfast. The area was quite busy and I saw this woman walking around looking for a place to sit. I asked her to join us. Shortly there-after he husband came and sat with us. After talking for a minute, I learned that he was Larry Appleton. He is a fellow canvas maker and frequently enters into competitions. He stressed his dismay if you will for a majority of the "competitive" style canvas decoys in the competitions. They were being made with additional wires and cork. He found it difficult to compete against them with his more traditional style of canvas with less wires and usually without cork for the breast or tail.

I kept my mouth shut and let Larry speak. I understood where he was coming from. In an ideal contest, there would be a traditional category and a modern category for the canvas. However, as you may know, MANY of the competitions do not even have a Canvas only category. For this reason, Rob Oliver and I add cork to the breast and tail, add additional wires and stretch the hell out of the canvas to make it so tight that you can bounce a quarter off of it. It's very rewarding when we win against wood.

I do question the on-the-water characteristics of a canvas decoy without cork. I'm sure that it would not float ideally in rougher waters such as bays. Some older models were self bailing and I'm told that they functioned poorly at best.
 
Mr. Braden -

I read your story and respect your opinion, but must disagree. A Canvas Decoy is NOT a wooden,or cork decoy. Nor do ribbons make it their equal. Hunting over them does.


Yet I do understand your joy in winning over wood, and cork decoys. For many years that was a No-No (and boy do I have first hand experience) even if they were better.

So if that is your intent I tip my hat to you. In contests you do succeed.


Years ago I was given the formula for a good canvas decoy, from a Currituck Sound waterman, and guide. It was passed down to him from his family, and their decoys worked for many, many, years.


The BOTTOM BOARD is the most important element of the canvas/wire decoy. In essence you ARE floating the Bottom Board.

ALL the added weight ABOVE the bottom board, defeats it's purpose and seaworthiness.


Failure DOES occur when the wrong size, and wrong type of wood, is used for the bottom board.

With the correct bottom board, and WIDTH. A canvas/wire decoy can, and will withstand bays. open water, and whatever type of conditions other decoys do.


I have gunned over my own canvas/wire decoys since the 1980's. Rivers, bays, sounds, lakes, open water, you name it. They take a licking and keep on ticking.

The only failures I have had,was when I used plywood (of any kind) for bottom birds. Lesson learned.


Think of a Canvas/wire decoy as a floating Shilhouette Decoy on a good bottom board, few wires, thin, strong light weight head & neck, and canvas and YA GOT IT.


Taught canvas that ya can bounce a quarter off IS, a working decoys enemy.

WHY?

Because if you understand the warp and weft of canvas, undo Stress is applied, and sooner or later will effect the Decoy and it's function. Canvas must breathe and be able to expand and contract.

I do not know how many of your gunning canvas decoys you have recovered, but that is part of the deal, and a learning experience. No vent = Mold and degradation of canvas.


Everything that you put above the Bottom Board Waterline, is FROSTING, heavy, or light. Success in old school comes with simplicity.


Enclosed are a few not good photo's of a Golden Eye I made years ago. It now resides with a buddy of mine. One like it, with a cork head, and wider body has been in my rig since the 1980's.

I have many other photo's of canvas decoys I made in various stages, wire/canvas, and wooden slat/canvas, if you are interested.


There is a article in the May, 1973 issue of Sports Afield, of a hunt over Canvas/wire Brant & Canada goose decoys. Photo's by Hanson Carroll,and a story by Nash Buckingham. The decoys are working just fine...


I do wish you well. Your New School, I am Old School, yet we are brothers.


Best regards
Vince



View attachment Golden eye 1.jpgView attachment Golden eye 2.jpgView attachment Golden eye 3.jpgView attachment Golden eye 4.jpg
 
Mr. Braden

These Giant Canada geese are by my hand. Two of six, in the rig. Each has a different head attitude.

They were made for me to hunt over, and were entered in the POOL contest, at Westlake, Ohio, in the 1990's, where they earned Blue Ribbons


Each decoy is very large. Wide, and very seaworthy. They still work just fine.

Some of the the heads are two pieces, and some are hollow. Weight above the waterline always the consideration.

The keels are oak, and made to hold line, and self right (heavier than the decoy).

Oil paint, as simple as I could make it (aka today ugly), but it sure does work.


In today's Canvas/wire decoy world, they are laughable .I understand that. As today's"decoys" are more taxidermy correct, than decoys ever were.

Since the top view is what most decoying birds see. I am at a loss to understand the photo realism in new decoy genres.


Joe Lincoln did it ALL.

Beyond that, was for people/collectors/carvers/decoy judges.

Adhering to that simplicity is much more difficult than it appears. It is a Walter Gropius, founder of the Bauhaus Effect, type of decoy.


I'm not certain but I do think DecoyMonsterMachine, Mr. George Williams, may understand my twisted way of decoy thinking...[;)]


Best regards
Vince



View attachment Giant Canada goose frame.jpgView attachment Giant Canada goose canvas done.jpg
 
Vince,
I understand what you are saying. I like the more traditional looking canvas decoys but they can't compete and aren't competitive against wood and cork in the competitions which is why a more contemporary style is warranted and that's why I make them that way. As stressed before very few shows even have a canvas only category anymore so isn't it a good thing that we still keep canvas decoys in the public eye by entering them into shows to make people aware of the different styles of decoys that can be made? I can immediately remember a dozen times at these shows where people came to check out the decoys because they were different and looked cool
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Saw some new canvas birds and first impression was they were wooden, until a closer look. Canvas decoys that look like canvas decoys are an art form all there own and do not need to mimic wood dekes.
Back at Westlake pool days a young man from MI. made some swans using a fabric that is used to make model airplanes. They were entered in the canvas catagorey but they weren't canvas?
I feel sub dividing contest divisions more and more makes room for more arguments.
My opinion.
Thx
Ken Yacavone
 
Mike -

You make some very valid points, and I respect your dedication to your art, and passion for canvas decoys. Love the photo of that old NC style canvas goose.


I do disagree about traditional canvas decoys not being able to compete with IWCA taxidermy style decoys (which are the norm in most of today's contests).

To keep true to the genre, the best traditional decoys should go against the best of the rest . Win, loose, or draw, IMO.

The "new" type of canvas/wire decoys has pushed the old style decoys even further back into obscurity. Many of today's decoy caver/makers are not students of decoy history, and it's place in North American history and that is a damn shame.


As far as canvas decoys being allowed to compete. More contests include them now than ever before, and that is because of the POOL at Ohio opened the door.

Not that many years ago I entered canvas decoys in a contest, even though they were not included in the contest. Of course I wasted my money entering them, but folks SAW them.

Now I do believe that contest includes canvas decoys.

Contests in general may be fewer than years before. Most now include canvas decoys.


To have to morph the decoys to something they are not, just to be accepted, and to win, goes against my grain. But again, that is my issue not yours.

It would be interesting to be able to count how many decoys of all kinds, are made just for contests. The number may exceed those decoys made just for gunning over. The reverse of how things were thirty, or more years ago.


Know matter what our intent, and what kind of decoys. We each do what we feel we must, to fulfill our purpose.


The contemporary decoy caver that I admire most is Jim Schmiedlin. He took battered and well used decoys out of his rigs, and Won over many others. To my knowledge he never made a decoy to win a contest. He stayed true to himself.

He was a innovator. Perhaps the new style of "canvas/wire" decoy falls into that category, if used hard for gunning. Only time will tell.


Over many years I entered many contests near and far. Yet the best place I found to get folks interested in Canvas decoys, is at boat launches, and wherever the decoys are used. They garner more attention there than anywhere.

The best inquiry was. "You hunt over those decoys?" Yup, every time I get a chance to.


I am enjoying this discussion very much. Thanks to all that participate and look see.


Best regards
Vince
 
Brother Ken

We have seen a change haven't we? Man O Man.

It was always good to see what you made and entered at the Pool. There were just a few of us crazy Canvas decoy makers north of the Mason-Dixon line.

Your observation about sub dividing contests and more arguments rings true. Of course contests and arguments go together like bread and butter.[;)]


Back in the day decoy contests had two divisions. Hunting Decoys and Decorative Decoys. That was it.

In the hunting class, there were many hundreds of decoys going against each other.

Now it seems there are more different kinds of decoy contests than "decoys" to fill them.


Could be time to go back to the basics, and let the chips fall where they may.


Best regards
Vince
 
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