Decoy Killers...

I'm with Dani... if you (figuratively speaking, I read original post as tongue-in-cheek but maybe you were more serious than I realized) are that worried about decoys getting hit with shot, hunt solo or with like-minded people.

I think it would be unethical to hunt divers with that mentality as there are sure to be cripples and if you are waiting for them to completely clear decoys before shooting a cripple then you will lose a LOT of birds in the process. There are great plastics out there for much lower price than hand carved if you don't want them shot. I hunt with a guy who makes and hunts with beautiful decoys (much nicer than the 3rd rate stuff I carve) and I'm not aware of him ever letting anyone "have it" for accidently shooting a decoy nor would he as decoys were intended to be hunted... I'm of like mind.

...with all that said, if it's a close friend then absolutely rib them for shooting a decoy and make him/her trade a birds of his or pay back in ways Mark W said :)
 
Dani, I would never punch a friend over an inanimate object no matter what the cost.

The original post was tongue and cheek mixed with frustration over my buddies lack of respect for the work and cost of the rig he has put very little into.

As much as it frustrates me I would never leave a friend behind. But an acquaintance is another story.

Glad everyone enjoyed my rant, now I can chuckle about some of the response as I fill holes and repaint for the eighth time in thirteen years.
 
When I was taking people out for Scoters and Goldeneyes and Harlequins I had a heck of a rig of decoys.....half of the Scoters were E.Allens and the rest a collection of birds from a variety of carvers.....all of the GE's and Harlequins were cork or wood.....if I rigged the entire spread it was over 150 decoys.....on a typical morning the first cripple down, didn't matter who shot it, got pasted BY ME no matter where in the spread it was....my way of telling people that it was not only o.k., but expected, to KILL THE BIRD.......usually there was one of those..."you just shot a decoy(S)".....to which my reply was "when the decoy becomes more important than killing the bird its times to stop shooting anything but overheads"....


My rig showed the effects of that thought process....now no question I rigged birds so that the real treasures were in a portion of the rig where I didn't expect, and hoped they wouldn't, get shot but over time a few of them did.....most of those were honest, "concentrating on the bird and didn't see the decoy" or a "cripple down and departing" scenario.......over the many years and people that hunted with me my Allen's and my stuff came to resemble Tramp Steamers raked by angry Tigers....rust streaked and shot gouged....unless a tail or bill was broken I never repaired them...what duck "see's" shot hole or a little rust?....and especially so divers and Sea Ducks?......these were working decoys, and while some of them did sit a shelf from time to time they were WORKING DECOYS and I expected them to end up with the character that the accidental damage gave them......


The "time for a dog" thing always tickles me....people saying "my dog died at 18 and NEVER LOST A CRIPPLE".....or "don't shoot the decoys send the dog".....in a big deep water decoy spread, and triple this if there is a chop of any short, and quadruple it if there is current, (not to mention what low angle shots produce), if you wait for a cripple to clear the decoys there isn't a dog in the World that can swim down a lightly hit bird....maybe once...by luck...but not consistently......My experience was that "most times" you had a very short opportunity to whack a bird on the water before he made his first dive....every dive reduced your chance of retrieve.....and every yard he traveled did the same......losing "most" of what you knocked down and spending your time picking up a dog who lost site of a cripple in a wicked chop and an 8 knot tide isn't why I duck hunt......


So while I value my decoys I value the birds I hunt and the friends I take far more.....if you can't handle a "hit" or a broken bill or tail as others have said......leave em at home or behind the muzzles....


Quick story and I'll shut up......Tod Osier and I believe Gary Potter, (for those with long memories), in my boat on Saratoga Passage out of Utsalady......behind a rock jetty and the wind was howling....the waves were breaking against the jetty behind ups and there were ducks as many as stars in the sky......normally we took turns shooting and only shot singles due to the cripple factor and to extend the hunt.....NORMALLY.....that is until a large flock of Barrows Goldeneyes roared into the rig.....a young war broke out and there were birds down the width of the decoy spread everyone having done their job of shooting their zone.....I shot a cripple and heard someone else yell "cripple' and then "I'm out"....I looked that direction and saw what I thought was a hen Barrows making her escape......I literally ROLL HER OVER with the shot.....only problem was tat it was a Hank Garvey wooden GE hen...one of a pair that he had competed in the Worlds with......if you know Hanks work you know this isn't a bird you would want to have shot up.......OOOOOPPPSSSSSssss.......I could have sent her to HAnk to fix....I could have fixed her myself......but you know what....when I look at her I don't see a decoy....I see a wild melee of swirling G.E.'s and two good friends shooting and laughing and enjoying a great hunt.....and isn't that what its all about?.........


Steve
 
When I was taking people out for Scoters and Goldeneyes and Harlequins I had a heck of a rig of decoys.....half of the Scoters were E.Allens and the rest a collection of birds from a variety of carvers.....all of the GE's and Harlequins were cork or wood.....if I rigged the entire spread it was over 150 decoys.....on a typical morning the first cripple down, didn't matter who shot it, got pasted BY ME no matter where in the spread it was....my way of telling people that it was not only o.k., but expected, to KILL THE BIRD.......usually there was one of those..."you just shot a decoy(S)".....to which my reply was "when the decoy becomes more important than killing the bird its times to stop shooting anything but overheads"....


My rig showed the effects of that thought process....now no question I rigged birds so that the real treasures were in a portion of the rig where I didn't expect, and hoped they wouldn't, get shot but over time a few of them did.....most of those were honest, "concentrating on the bird and didn't see the decoy" or a "cripple down and departing" scenario.......over the many years and people that hunted with me my Allen's and my stuff came to resemble Tramp Steamers raked by angry Tigers....rust streaked and shot gouged....unless a tail or bill was broken I never repaired them...what duck "see's" shot hole or a little rust?....and especially so divers and Sea Ducks?......these were working decoys, and while some of them did sit a shelf from time to time they were WORKING DECOYS and I expected them to end up with the character that the accidental damage gave them......


The "time for a dog" thing always tickles me....people saying "my dog died at 18 and NEVER LOST A CRIPPLE".....or "don't shoot the decoys send the dog".....in a big deep water decoy spread, and triple this if there is a chop of any short, and quadruple it if there is current, (not to mention what low angle shots produce), if you wait for a cripple to clear the decoys there isn't a dog in the World that can swim down a lightly hit bird....maybe once...by luck...but not consistently......My experience was that "most times" you had a very short opportunity to whack a bird on the water before he made his first dive....every dive reduced your chance of retrieve.....and every yard he traveled did the same......losing "most" of what you knocked down and spending your time picking up a dog who lost site of a cripple in a wicked chop and an 8 knot tide isn't why I duck hunt......


So while I value my decoys I value the birds I hunt and the friends I take far more.....if you can't handle a "hit" or a broken bill or tail as others have said......leave em at home or behind the muzzles....


Quick story and I'll shut up......Tod Osier and I believe Gary Potter, (for those with long memories), in my boat on Saratoga Passage out of Utsalady......behind a rock jetty and the wind was howling....the waves were breaking against the jetty behind ups and there were ducks as many as stars in the sky......normally we took turns shooting and only shot singles due to the cripple factor and to extend the hunt.....NORMALLY.....that is until a large flock of Barrows Goldeneyes roared into the rig.....a young war broke out and there were birds down the width of the decoy spread everyone having done their job of shooting their zone.....I shot a cripple and heard someone else yell "cripple' and then "I'm out"....I looked that direction and saw what I thought was a hen Barrows making her escape......I literally ROLL HER OVER with the shot.....only problem was tat it was a Hank Garvey wooden GE hen...one of a pair that he had competed in the Worlds with......if you know Hanks work you know this isn't a bird you would want to have shot up.......OOOOOPPPSSSSSssss.......I could have sent her to HAnk to fix....I could have fixed her myself......but you know what....when I look at her I don't see a decoy....I see a wild melee of swirling G.E.'s and two good friends shooting and laughing and enjoying a great hunt.....and isn't that what its all about?.........


Steve
Amen... I shot your scoter rig! I remember hunting over wassons handcarved cedar eider rig for the first time. I downed a bird in the rig and was tracking it waiting for it to clear the dekes when i heard wasson tell me to shoot! I cringed as i shot the bird and sprayed some nice decoys. But i got the bird!......
 
Not many people hunt there decoys as hard as we do. We run 6-8 dozen handmade cork and wood decoys on longlines with the layout. We don't aim for the decoys however if the birds are doing what they should and we are waiting for the best shots, decoys get hit. I'm proud to say with our crew the decoys take their fair share of shot in a season.


Im in with this reply. Hunt cheaper decoys. They are diver ducks, if they're finishing, decoys are getting shot. If he's swatting crips right on top of dekes on purpose or something, make him help patch decoys.

I can't see spending buku bucks on diver decoys when I know they'll be taking pellets. Period. It just happens if they are working in right. If he just doesn't care, then let him start fixing them.
 
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Steve, This whole thread was worth reading if for no reason than to get to your last paragraph.
 
I have known people that PURPOSLY shot decoys. I will not hunt with them again.

If you are swatting a cripple, control yourself.. . a tiny bit... and wait for it clear the blocks.... (Puddlers)and you have a better chance of hitting the bird too!!!

When hunting divers... or seaducks... POUND THE SOB!!!!! I hate chasing cripples... 90% of my diver decoys are foam, so I don't care if they get shot. If you are diver hunting, (especially layout hunting) I think you should expect blocks to get peppered.

Now... If you have 1 particular partner that seems to repeditively peppers them... I would make them help repair them.
 
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Both decoys were harmed in the making of this photo. I'll never fix them, those steel 2's jog way too many good memories from last season. They are decoys, it happens...

Now, if it happened by the same guy, regularly; he'd be fixing them, signing them, and returning them.

A8D10F35-9DF4-4DE2-9513-939D5B364B6B_zpsmwdqixny.jpg

 
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Where I diver hunt you don't have the luxury of waiting for crips to clear the dekes, just to many variables. You have to dispose of them asap. Most dekes take some shot during the season, I try and place my quack rubber dekes where I want the birds to commit. They take shot better than most, and no repairs on them yet. Plastic decoys i'm always pacthing up.
Its usually just my son and myself so no intentional shooting of the dekes.
 
Jeff R- Having seen you shoot....I expect all my decoys to duck. As for partners that hit my decoys, I expect them to buy the beverages later in the evening. Decoys can be fixed (in fact, it is part of the reason for having them) but welcome hunting partners are hard to find and certain personal habits (such as ground swatting my decoy) may have to be ignored.

Hutch
 
The decoys that I sort of made last year to hunt scoters over took a few hits. Nothing made me prouder than shooting the decoys because the birds worked them so well.

One of them with lots of steel in it is actually on my mantle. I have a few decoys I have made this year. I am looking forward to shooting them too.
 
Quick story and I'll shut up......Tod Osier and I believe Gary Potter, (for those with long memories), in my boat on Saratoga Passage out of Utsalady......behind a rock jetty and the wind was howling....the waves were breaking against the jetty behind ups and there were ducks as many as stars in the sky......normally we took turns shooting and only shot singles due to the cripple factor and to extend the hunt.....NORMALLY.....that is until a large flock of Barrows Goldeneyes roared into the rig.....a young war broke out and there were birds down the width of the decoy spread everyone having done their job of shooting their zone.....I shot a cripple and heard someone else yell "cripple' and then "I'm out"....I looked that direction and saw what I thought was a hen Barrows making her escape......I literally ROLL HER OVER with the shot.....only problem was tat it was a Hank Garvey wooden GE hen...one of a pair that he had competed in the Worlds with......if you know Hanks work you know this isn't a bird you would want to have shot up.......OOOOOPPPSSSSSssss.......I could have sent her to HAnk to fix....I could have fixed her myself......but you know what....when I look at her I don't see a decoy....I see a wild melee of swirling G.E.'s and two good friends shooting and laughing and enjoying a great hunt.....and isn't that what its all about?.........


Steve


HAHA that gave me a good laugh and also I know what you mean about looking at it and seeing the memory.

Two seasons ago I was invited to duck hunt on a deer lease, it was a bit chaotic with the deer hunters. In layout blinds I think there were 6 of us spread along the bank. At one point during the hunt my buddy next to me informed me that at the end of the lineup one of the guys was teaching his son to aim by repeatedly shooting my decoys with a BB gun. I was at a bit of a loss internally, ended up just keeping my mouth shut. I thought about approaching the dad privately but honestly they were shooting earlier work that I was no longer proud of and I didn't have a real positive read on the guy anyway. I had to let that one go and it doesn't bother me other than I probably won't be duck hunting with that guy again.

On the flip side of the coin, last year I had three memorial birds in the spread. They contained small pieces of the wreckage of my dad's plane inside. We were hunting redheads on the coast and I placed them very close to the blind and told my partners, who had never hunted over hand carved blocks before that even hand carved decoys get shot, but I would like for them to think twice before shooting near these three blocks. All other decoys were fair game. I really did put them more or less out of any shot zone, but I was ok with hunting them, and ok with damage. I ended up hunting with 5 different people that weekend, and on each hunt after I said this people got a little serious for the first few minutes of settling in, but once birds approached and we started downing them (which doesn't take long on a redhead hunt) the party lightened up immediately and it was just your standard hunt: laughs, stories, high fives and scenery. At the end of those hunts as I brought the blocks into shore they were all more or less inspected by the other guys and gals, the memorial decoys more so. While I would have been ok with stray shot, the only birds that took shot were in the pocket, as I suspected.
 
pellet holes in decoys = scars of pride, cold hands around a mug of steaming coffee, two friends laughing at your miss while frost grows on the snot hanging off your nose, a country ham biscuit eaten with mittens, whitecaps and scudding clouds, and then the perfect set--out front with wings locked and feet down.
 
It happens. If folks are worried about it they don't need to be hunting with them. And if hunters who carve are worried about it, they need to stick to shelf birds.
Only time I ever got halfway ticked off was when I guy we were hunting with said he'd retrieve the birds and decoys. He went out in the canoe and instead of getting close to the decoys, he starts wacking them with the paddle trying to pull the decoys closer to him.
 
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