Feeding dog before or after hunt?

D

David Stern

Active member
Hi:
I have always been told to feed the dog after the hunt. Is that still the common practice? I am sometimes getting up 3-4 hours before daylight to get to my spot. Think 3:30 wake up for me and the pooch and a 6:30ish shooting time.
Stern
 
I usually feed my boy a light amount before the hunt if I know it'll be at least an hour before he'll be working. Throughout the day he might get a snack (like apple pieces and cores or a cracker if that's what we're munching, but not a lot). Then at dinner he'll get a bigger meal. I know some people say ONLY feed at night after the hunt. I'm not really sure what the "right" answer is, but that's what I do with my boy.

Dani
 
I feed 3 cups daily, 1 in the morning and 2 at night. I generally feed 2.5 cups the night before we hunt. I've tried to feed a little meal before a hunt if there's a long gap between leaving and working time, like you mentioned. but my dog won't eat so I've quit trying. She'll generally sneak a snack or two in the blind if we are hunting with someone nicer than me :)

I'm no expert but I do know that they don't digest like we do, 12 hours for a meal to fully digest if I recall correctly.
 
I too only feed after the hunt. Usually there is a biscuit during the hunt after a retrieve or if we are snacking. The dog works so hard and is full of go all the time I feel it helps to keep her energy going especially when it is really cold.
 
My dog won't usually eat before a duck hunt. He knows that if we get up that early something is up. I try to feed him extra the evening before.

When we are just going to be pheasant hunting later in the day he will eat some in the morning. He eats most of his food in the evening so I just keep him on that schedule.

After hearing from several vets I'm not too concerned about when he eats as long as its not right before or after a hunt/training.

I do try to have some food along and maybe some honey or syrup just in case he would crash out hunting.

Tim
 
I believe that if a dog is hungry and will eat before hunting, then you should feed it. The dog will be expending energy and burning calories while hunting.
 
Usually fed my dog extra the night before. My dog wouldn't eat before going ducking.Might eat a part of my snack, but wouldn't take bone snacks, just her disposition... I like my coffee and snacks or I get agitated...
 
My dogs have all been free fed, they have food in front of them all the time starting from newly weaned pups, Nutro Ultra, never had any issues.
 
My dog has freed food as well and eats when she wants. never been a weight problem. She won't eat in the am if I have camo or a gun or get up early because she knows what is up.
 
My buddies old dog Daisy was like that, all business in the boat.
We could be eating steak in the boat and she could care less.
We would have to put snacks in her mouth, she wouldn't even look down, just open her mouth for us to put them in & keep watching the sky while chewing.
Sure do miss that Daisy dog, never had formal training, from the 1st day in the boat she just knew whey she was there. Learned what left, right & back meant on the job. She simply was one of those labs that was "born with "it".
She has been gone 10 years. But my buddy and I still get a little misty eyed when we talk about her in the boat. But I digress....

[inline Daisy3.jpg]

View attachment Daisy3.jpg
 
I've always fed my dogs a moderate amount in the morning before a hunt. Usually there's a couple of hours (or more) between the time she eats and shooting light. As has been said, the dog will be out in the elements and burning calories.

If you think the dog may need extra food, then I would add that to the dinner ration.
 
So I'll preface this with the disclaimer that I am a canine sports medicine specialist, and the only boarded specialist whose focus is on hunting dogs. My answer is based on what the research has shown and my career experience that has predominantly been with hunting dogs. This isn't meant to say anyone not doing this is wrong, but there is a "best" way, but it isn't the best way for all dogs and I certainly don't get this technical every time with my own girls.

From a performance aspect it has been shown that dog's do best on an empty stomach, this has many factors that go into it, one of which is purely mechanical damage that is done by the food and stool bouncing around while the dog works. Many times performance diarrhea is related to this mechanical damage and not the often blamed stress. This is contrary to how we would feel, but their systems are different than ours and the performance, metabolically is better. Now, there are certain situations that this doesn't work, for example a dog that battles hypoglycemia, I would feed those dogs a small amount in the morning and the majority after the hunt.

Also, there is a recovery window and it is best to feed after work as the body is primed to repair muscle and replenish enzyme systems. Once a dog is calmed down, cooled and recovered is when I typically feed. Again, this can be different...particularly when talking waterfowl dog versus say an upland dog. But to get the best bang I go into the day fasted and feed for timing of recovery.

As far as what to eat, high quality food is important, and this is a can of worms I'd rather not open. I still believe the major manufacturers, generally speaking, produce the best foods in their premium lines. I think too many people justify feeding a garbage food and too many people overpay for high end foods. In the field feeding should be based primarily around simple sugars. I personally use dextrose, but have also used the Purina bar products or the K9 Restart in the water. Using complex foods (protein/fat, etc) actually can be counterproductive as the dog is either performing and so blood flow should be away from the GI tract and towards the muscles and/or the glucose-insulin balance is what we are looking to maintain.

That's my quick and dirty answer in between appointments.

Joe Spoo DVM, CCRT, DACVSMR
Diplomate American College of Veterinary Sports Medicine and Rehabilitation
 
Thanks, very interesting information that prompts a couple of follow-up questions!

Most of your comments appear to be directed toward a scenario experienced by a hunting retriever working in fields on upland game over the course of a day. Could you be more specific to a working retriever that is doing either field or water retrieves intermittently, and sitting in a blind or boat for three to six hours over the course of a hunt?

Do you have a time interval estimate on the "recovery window" interval in dogs? Human physiology data indicates somewere between 1/2 to 1 hour, post cool-down, is the optimal "window" to restore muscle glycogen via carb. intake. Do you have any recommendation for hunting retrievers? Do you feel there is any difference between the constituents of the Purina performance bars and a standard Powerbar? The ingredients are similar and listed in the same order.
 
I dont feed my dog on hunt mornings. I mostly hunt out of a boat, and that is kind of a low effort for my dog. The few times I fed him, he got kind of antsy after a while and left me a big present on the bow deck! Rich
 
I agree with others that a "normal breakfast" isn't really a high priority or an option for an excited dog the morning of a hunt.
I'm curious, though, why the intake of a working dog would differ much from that of a competing athlete who would fuel himself throughout a race with Goo packets and Clif bars? I typically offer small scoops of food to my pup throughout the morning to offset the calorie burn going on particularly in cold water and/or weather. An empty stomach seems like it would result in a short, cold hunt.
 
It makes sense not to feed a dog if it'll be running out the door within an hour and chasing upland birds.

But much of our duck hunting is out of the boat, on large lakes, between November and January. Temps are usually somewhere between 15F and 35F. And some days we don't shoot many birds, so there's a lot of sitting around.

Our late season routine is like this:

4:15 wake up and feed dog


5:00 leave house

5:45 get to launch

6:30 boat’s anchored at the spot, decoys are set

7:00 shooting light


If it’s real cloudy or snowy we may not end up shooting anything until 7:30. That’s a good 3 hours after eating that the dogs been sitting around. What if it’s a slow day and we stick it out till the afternoon. Seems like a long time to be sitting in the weather on an empty stomach. What if she doesn’t even get to retrieve?

Molly will rarely eat while we’re hunting. But she’s always willing to eat breakfast, so I feed her then.







 
To answer most of the questions.

These dogs are still working and I would view their work like interval training rather than pure endurance...at the end of the day it's still work and exercise and so the same rules apply. In reference to the sitting in the cold part, I would answer that with a question:where would you want the dog's blood flow and energy directed --- keeping them warm and active or processing and digesting food? It's not like putting that food in the belly is stoking a fire, it needs to broken down into usable energy which means blood flow and energy will be directed to that rather than work and keeping warm if you feed prior to a hunt.

As to the reference of a human athlete, partially correct. As I mentioned, the studies have shown these dogs do better on a fast. Their exercise fuel burning is different than ours and so you can't extrapolate as to what you would do. The day we are able to do what they can do from a physical standpoint we could have those discussions. Where the similarities are is during exercise in that the only thing I supplement is simple sugar based. The brain can only use glucose and thus if I feed during activity it's simple sugar, and in my case dextrose. When duck hunting I don't as the endurance part isn't there and I've never worried about my chessie or cocker "tapping out" while duck hunting like my setters can chasing prairie grouse. If you look at the human performance products (Gu, clif shots, bloks, etc) they are basically different lengths of sugars. I personally don't use the human products in my dogs mainly because I worry about things like if xylitol or other sweeteners are used that may be detrimental to a dog so I keep it simple and use canine specific products. Also, if you have ever dried to eat a frozen PowerBar or gel blok it's just cruel (up until three years ago I was a multiple marathons and triathlons a year guy).

With regards to the recovery window, yes it exists and is similar I caution to make sure a dog is calmed down, comfortable and not panting prior to feeding.

Think I hit them all, I've spent the last four days chasing prairie birds and ducks and now have some work to get done before I start the day tomorrow. If I missed a question let me know.
 
Joe:
What canine brand Dextrose do you use?
I think your explanation of the topic is very enlightening. My dog will be hunting on an empty stomach for now on.

Stern
 
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