First carveing !

Bill T

Bill T

Active member
Well i have gotten to the fine tuning stage of my first decoy .I have done the body out of cork and the head out of basswood . I need to clean it up a little then a keel ,not to sure how i'm going to keel it ,never done it .And seal it and paint what do i use to seal it and how do you add a keel ? And make it secure on the bird. Is glue and screwing good enough ?


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Beautiful job. I like the carved eye. When you finish painting the eye, coat it with a bit of laquer, and you won't be able to tell it from a glass one.
With no bottom board, just use a good waterproof glue and screws long enough to drive well up into the cork body - you shouldn't have any issues.


Here's an example of a painted wooden eye with the shiny overcoat (on a miniature):

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If you plan on using the decoy, SEALING CAREFULLY is an absolute must--i use at least three coats of gac700-a golden acrylic product, and base my dekes with one coat of black before painting-The sealing is a must, since all of the newer tan cork has a tendancy to wick water into the minute voids between material-
Sugestion for attaching the keel-DO NOT use a screw-you can use either a good expandable glue, like gorilla, or a good, waterproof contact cement-i prefer the contact, because it dries quicker and you have less probvlem with material bubbling out around the keel--as far as weighting, this is just a thought-
use a spade bit or forstner bit--up to one inch diameter, depending upon the width of the keel-for small dekes, like teal, a smaller bit is fine--drill one or two cylinders, being careful not to go thru the bottom! lead the holes, paint keels--all sides--hint--lead aft of the center of keel for divers, and fore for puddlers--this is just a general scheme! put a rubber band around the body and keel and flaot test to see where deke rides level--if it lists, just move keel until it is level-you can also see if it will self-right at this point-mark with penclil-allow to dry after removing rubber band--apply glue to both surfaces if using contact- allow to dry to touch-press, and voila! the deke is ready for service--reccommend that you now paint the bottom one more time!!
i have probably said enough, but guys making gunners en masse do this all the time---my reluctance to use a screw with this is just a matter of realizing that if you use a long screw thru the keel as well as the glue, you have compromised the coats of sealer and that breach may become a source of water wicking into the body--SIGH! i really miss Wiley! never had to go thru all this fuss!
Have fun.
 
Another way to fasten keels that I have had the best luck with...use a coarse threaded deck screw, seal your bird and the keel on all sides..the keel should be sealed AFTER your screw holes are drilled so you can run sealer down the holes.....Get some GeoCell Pro Seal in clear....run a bead around the perimiter of the keel..then a bead around the screw holes and up into the screw hole...then screw the keel on. The Pro Seal is one tough adhesive caulk that water won't effect when dry...much more so than glue. If you want, you can put another coat of sealer over it when it is cured.
 
The sealer is that a specialty item our can i get it localy ?And the name of it ? The best to use ?
 
I just read my post and it should be PRO FLEX....it's a caulk. As for sealer, I use just about anything that is open in the shop..could be interior poly..exterior poly or Val Oil. I have been using water based because of cleanup..even cheap brushes get expensive after a while. What paint are you going to use?
 
lee, i stopped using screws, simply because the insertion of a screw, dowel or anything else, which pierces the sealer, which was applied to prevent water seepage, is instantly compromised---i have not experienced problems without the screw--contact seems to hold efficiently--only problem i can remember is a deke thet someone was tossing out of a boat while standing on the wieght cord--YEP! the keel and deke separated, but interestingly, it did it below thepoint of attachment-the bond was, in fact, stronger than the two pieces it connected!
imo, all of that extra work---prescrewing and then filling the hole with some expander is just too much like work!
 
I will be useing Golden Acrylics . So just use a polyurathane to seal it.the head and all ? Could you tell me a brand and type so i can run to the hard wear to get some i dont want to mess up .
 
Bill, you are a man after my own heart!! Get gac 700 from your dealer--it is a pretty good sealer from golden-use three coats, just to make sure you have left no voids! then base with either burnt umber of mars black, carbon black, whatever
The deke will kinda look like a glazed donut when ready for the base coat---you might want to add a tablespoon of wetting agent to a quart of the stuff---seems to stop bubbles!
if using polyurethane, try getting the water based variety-should work as well when you use a few coats
 
By Dealer you mean a hardware ? I was hopeing something i would not have to order .I'm clueless i'm %100 new to this decoy carveing stuff .
 
No, he means Goldens dealer. Just go to the local ACE hardware and get a quart of waterbased polyurethane..exterior if they have it. I think Carver-Tripp makes one. If you get bubbles(and you will) while brushing it on..just blow on it..the carbon dioxide from your breath will pop them so they flatten out and cover..also , brush every which way...back and forth and up and down so the sealer gets into all the pores.
 
Nice looking bird. Lee, who knew about the co2 thing. Are you serious? I have never tried that one. I usually seal, and when it is drying and your brush is getting dry I will go over it again. Only drawback is that you may see brushstrokes as the acrylic sealant is thicker.

I will have to try the breathing thing after a few jalapenos.
 
Well Ira you may be on to something... the hottter the better.
If I was a guessing man, I'd say it's the warmth (hot air?) of his breath and air pressure, is expanding and bursting Lee's bubbles!!

Another trick about getting a good seal, or penetration, no matter what product you use for a sealer, is to warm the cork/wood before sealing. It could be as subtle as letting the dekes set out in the hot sun in the afternoon and then seal them in the evening. As the cork/wood cools through the night, it will draw the sealer into the tiny voids. to speed the process and if the Mrs. doesn't mind, you could set your oven to the lowest "Warm" setting and let them "bake" for 1/2 hr. to get the deke warm then seal it.
 
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That was a trick I learned years ago...you don't have to blow hard..just like you were whistling a tune..don't want to hyper ventilate and regain consious with a deke stuck to your forehead. If you wait till the finish thickens, the hybiscus(sp?) of the bubble peels off and you have a hole in your finish.
 
meniscus, or miniscus, cous,whatever-Lee, try some photo flo, which is a wetting agent, in the water based urethane--it seems to hold the bubbles down/
 
Thanks George...I new it was iscus something..anyway, the top of the bubble dries quicker than the rest since it is micro thin..a gentle breath of air while brushing works great. I am afraid of adding flow agents in fear of it weakening the poly link chain of the sealer (waterbased). I thin oil based for better penetration on the first coat usually then a couple full strength.
 
I am afraid of adding flow agents in fear of it weakening the poly link chain of the sealer (waterbased). I thin oil based for better penetration on the first coat usually then a couple full strength.
Click to expand...


I was actually thinking about this last night while I was in the basement painting. I have for a long time thinned oil based varnish 50/50 with mineral spirits as a seal coat on bare wood. On my ducks I am using Jansen's cork sealer, which Willy told me is the same stuff as is in the regular wood (multi-purpose) sealer but with a higher solids content. I was thinking why on a dry, sucking, porous surface whould you want a higher solids content.

May the opinions come forth...

By the way, I am happy with the product I am using, just trying to have a better understanding of why I am doing what I am doing.

Chuck
 
Chuck, usually a thinned seal coat is used to even the surface and seal the pores of the project. If you use full strength, you can have spots that suck it in and other spots that won't hardly take it..you can see the effects when the light hits it..high and low spots in the finish. Doesn't make a tinkers dam on a deke. I do it on dekes for adhesion of subsequent coats..the thinned coat penetrates and the top coats stick to the seal coat...at least I think so and it makes me feel better.The "solids" are the material you are paying for..the rest of the can is solvent and flashes off or evaporates.
 
Chuck,

Painting in the basement over mineral spirits will get a guy thinking of all sorts of strange questions. I find a little bourbon will do the same thing - careful with the drawknife after that though...

:-)

Charlie

I am afraid of adding flow agents in fear of it weakening the poly link chain of the sealer (waterbased). I thin oil based for better penetration on the first coat usually then a couple full strength.
Click to expand...


I was actually thinking about this last night while I was in the basement painting. I have for a long time thinned oil based varnish 50/50 with mineral spirits as a seal coat on bare wood. On my ducks I am using Jansen's cork sealer, which Willy told me is the same stuff as is in the regular wood (multi-purpose) sealer but with a higher solids content. I was thinking why on a dry, sucking, porous surface whould you want a higher solids content.

May the opinions come forth...

By the way, I am happy with the product I am using, just trying to have a better understanding of why I am doing what I am doing.

Chuck
Click to expand...
 
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