? for the outboard motor guys

J

JimG

Well-known member
So I pop the cover off of my TDB, clean it out and go to give the engine a test run. I notice the pizzer isn't pizzing due to a mud wasp or something so I pop the cover off the motor to work on that and find THIS. Just a failed gasket or is there more to it than that? It's a '99 Mariner 25 2-stroke.





Jim
 
Hard to tell for sure from the photo. Could be just the gasket. Have you run this since last season? Any chance water may have froze in it? If water froze in the corner it may have cracked the plate as well as destroyed the gasket. Only way to tell is remove the bolts and inspect both mating surfaces.
 
How did I know that Dave would be the first respondee? Personal issues interfered with last season. I got out all of 3 times and pre-freeze. I did not shoot a single duck, but brought out a young guy (28 this year?) and his little half brother who I think was 16. As far as I know everything was fine my last time out. I hope that it's only the gasket. That is a budget buster all by itself. Parted ways with my employer 12/30 last year and started my own company which isn't making money yet. I'm not pulling anything apart until I get a new gasket, but I hope that the cover isn't warped. might be tough to find for a 15 year old Mariner/Merc.
 
Don't despair, if the cover plate is warped, it can be usually be saved. You can flatten (if needed) the sealing surface of the cover plate by honing it on a piece of wet/dry sandpaper backed up by a truly flat surface. A thick piece of glass works well for this. Work the warped cover plate around in endless figure 8's for the best results.

Hopefully it's only the gasket and you can save a bunch of elbow grease.
 
Dave,

It looks like I need to order two gaskets. Just in case. There is the outer over, gasket, a spacer that I'm sure has different water/exhaust ports, and another gasket. The way my luck goes, I'll pull the bolts and the inner gasket will come loose and the outer gasket stuck to the plate and spacer like it was welded there....
 
Be careful with the bolts on that side cover, they could be rusted in pretty tight. Don't break them. Looks like you got good advice from everyone. Good luck.
 
Oh no....I think I've just been jinxed.....

Yeah, thinking I should pull the bolts, carefully, then order new ones along with the gaskets.
 
Jim,
(A) Soak everything with a penetrant, adding more as you progress
(B) on the ones where you have direct access, take a solid pin punch of about 5/8 diameter, place it flat against the bolt head and give it a sharp rap with a hammer. Not too heavy but not just a tap. I hesitate a bit to suggest this, as it is a learned technique, but can have a beneficial effect on loosening the bolts.
(C) loosen the bolts in reverse of how you will retighten, ie; a little at a time on each one. (adding a bit more penetrant as you go, it will seep on down into the remaining threads.
(D) take a tap and clean the threads before installing new bolts. Blow the debris out with air pressure.
 
Razzle-frazzle. Well, I was 77.7% successful in the bolt removal. Most of the bolts broke loose and I only needed my fingers to loosen (makes me wonder if the solution was to slightly tighten the one bolt at the leak... Now what? The remains have been sprayed with PB blaster. The lower, if the PB does it's job, I may be able to back out the lower one with vice grips. Less than 1/4" in the threads. The other is every bit of 1/4". Do those "EZ-Out" bits actually work or do I have a drilling and tapping lesson in my future? (the bolts are M6...)


 
Jim,
Yes they do work,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, sometimes. :>)
The process you pursue all depends on what tools you have available. Some methods work better than others, but you need the right tools.
If you like, give me a call tonight after 5:30pm and before 7:30pm CDT (I work a 11.5 hr. shift and my free time is limited.) I can discuss your options with you, if you would care for my opinion.
(319) 239-4480
 
Sorry for the jinx, of course I never had that happen (heehee) just trying to give a heads up. I really have had good luck with a combination of left handed drill bits, heat and Kroil. Heat, then Kroil, then drill. Daves impact trick is a good one too. Seriously- GOOD LUCK. P.S. Then of course there is always Heli-Coils.
 
I picked up an Alden Pro "Grabit"... One of the reviewers removed busted threads on a motorcycle engine head with one. He said just GO SLOW.

And an M6 tap to clean the threads on the good holes. If the Grabit doesn't work, drill and re-tap is next I suppose.

Helicoils will be a last resort.

I have two months to figure it out.
 
i like these type of extractors- short, stubby, multi flute. the grabits should be good. they look similar

http://www.irwin.com/tools/screw-bolt-extractors/hex-head-multi-spline-screw-extractors-522532-series

hardest part is getting the hole in the right place and aligned with the stud. if you are worried about getting the holes right, as much as i hate to suggest it, have a look at brokenbolt.com for ideas. i have seen in in use and have thought about making one with drill jig bushings and flat stock.
there is no rule that says that you can not start drilling a smaller hole working up to a larger one either
soak and soak and soak some more. sometime a LITTLE bit of heat helps the kroil/pb blaster penetrate too. not cherry red kind of heat. like melting candle wax kind of heat.
 
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Partially correct Mike.

Grabit didn't work

Drilled out the two bolts

Tapped first one near perfect

Broke the TAP in the second one

Nobody to hear me, so I cussed internally, then set my tools down, walked into the house, and had a beer

Found a "tap extractor" tool made by Walton. $12 from Brownells, bringing my tool bill for this project to around $50....

The saga continues.........
 
Mike,

I thought Southern Gentlemen didn't cuss (at least not often). On one trip to Chatt it was pointed out by a Southern associate that even our New England woman have garbage mouths. After that I started to notice how few F-bombs and other expletives were being dropped. Definitely a difference.

Scott

Jim, You have my sympathy, I think most of us have broken off a bolt or two and its never fun! Good luck.
 
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I thought I'd provide an update of sorts.

I bought a Walton Tools broken tap extractor..... didn't work

I tried to shatter the tap with a punch and hammer, and pushed it deep into the hole, and I can thread the bolt most of the way in, plenty for the purpose. I may just have to add a couple of washers to the bolt but I'll have plenty of bite on the threads.

Time to order the gaskets and extra bolts.

Thanks for the advice to all, especially Dave
 
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