Hey Joe O.....
- Thread starter Howard
- Start date
Howard,I have run it a couple times in the barrel.After a few minutes at fast idle it heats up pretty good.I stopped by an evinrude dealer friday to see if I could
get a seal gasket for the cover,(No luck,can't order either)and asked them about cooling etc.They told me I should be able to touch the head when running.After 3 or 4
minutes It gets too hot and the shaft is just as hot.I dont want to ruin the motor,(starts and runs great)so I believe I'll put a impeller kit in it.No water discharges through the port half way up the shaft.Any suggestions?
get a seal gasket for the cover,(No luck,can't order either)and asked them about cooling etc.They told me I should be able to touch the head when running.After 3 or 4
minutes It gets too hot and the shaft is just as hot.I dont want to ruin the motor,(starts and runs great)so I believe I'll put a impeller kit in it.No water discharges through the port half way up the shaft.Any suggestions?
Joe,
I missed your first posting so I don't know just what engine you are talking about but here is something in general to consider. As to the seal for engine cover, maybe a seal for a larger cover would work if it was the same profile? I'm referring to the profile as viewed in a cross-section view. If it was for a larger cover, you would have extra length and would need to cut a section out of it to make it fit. This wouldn't be much different than buying some by the foot and cutting to fit?? I imagine the ends could be glued together with automotive weather stripping adhesive.
As to the cooling issue, Is this a "new to you" motor? When you replace the impeller check the impeller housing and seals, also shaft condition where the seal rests. Also check the water tube o-rings, both ends, top and bottom of tube. When you take the lower unit off, remove it slowly and check to see if the water tube is inserted properly into the water pump. Maybe it wasn't lined up and didn't get inserted properly into the water pump during prior reassembly.
One other thing, sometimes when running a motor in a barrel if the barrel or container is not large enough, too much turbulence is created and the water pump will air lock. Removing the prop will help lower the turbulence but even the exhaust gases will put a lot of air into the water being sucked into the water pump, thus lowering the efficiency of the pump.
Just a couple things to consider.
I missed your first posting so I don't know just what engine you are talking about but here is something in general to consider. As to the seal for engine cover, maybe a seal for a larger cover would work if it was the same profile? I'm referring to the profile as viewed in a cross-section view. If it was for a larger cover, you would have extra length and would need to cut a section out of it to make it fit. This wouldn't be much different than buying some by the foot and cutting to fit?? I imagine the ends could be glued together with automotive weather stripping adhesive.
As to the cooling issue, Is this a "new to you" motor? When you replace the impeller check the impeller housing and seals, also shaft condition where the seal rests. Also check the water tube o-rings, both ends, top and bottom of tube. When you take the lower unit off, remove it slowly and check to see if the water tube is inserted properly into the water pump. Maybe it wasn't lined up and didn't get inserted properly into the water pump during prior reassembly.
One other thing, sometimes when running a motor in a barrel if the barrel or container is not large enough, too much turbulence is created and the water pump will air lock. Removing the prop will help lower the turbulence but even the exhaust gases will put a lot of air into the water being sucked into the water pump, thus lowering the efficiency of the pump.
Just a couple things to consider.
Dave,thanks for the info.There was turbulence in the barrel.The last thing I did was remove the barrel ,remove the water in-take plate,and hold a water hose up to the port
while starting and running the motor.
I've never had to maintail an outboard before.My neighbor will repair it for the use of it on his fishing skiff.I'll sur save your notes on things to check.
while starting and running the motor.
I've never had to maintail an outboard before.My neighbor will repair it for the use of it on his fishing skiff.I'll sur save your notes on things to check.
Howard
Well-known member
Dave this is a 6 hp Evenrude I recently sold Joe. I had the points and plugs replaced and tuned up and the carb was rebuilt 3 seasons (2 years ago). I replaced the water pump myelf when I converted it from a long shaft to a short shaft. I used it on my sneak box for 3 seasons and never had a moments trouble with it. The only reason I put it up for sale is that I got a 9.9. the O rings and seals on the bottom of the power head are all new too.
Lee Harker
Well-known member
If it's a small barrel the water will heat up and give a false temp. The lake water where you are isn't a 100 degrees is it?
Hi Howard and Lee,I did have it in a small barrel however, the water never heated up in the barrel after running 3-4 minutes at fast idle.The shaft became too hot to touch as did the engine head.I made sure the water covered the intake,but as Dave stated,there could be enough turbulence to cause an air lock,so I removed the plate and held a water hose
at the intake while starting /running.I shut it down and flushed out the exhaust opening and shaft opening with the hose.Later I wondered if I may have introduced water into the engine,so will pull the plugs and turn it over to check for water in the cylinders,before starting again.On your reccomendation, I am inclined to take it out and try it.At what point,and what indication do I look for to tell me to shut it down?Lake water is under 90 by now.
at the intake while starting /running.I shut it down and flushed out the exhaust opening and shaft opening with the hose.Later I wondered if I may have introduced water into the engine,so will pull the plugs and turn it over to check for water in the cylinders,before starting again.On your reccomendation, I am inclined to take it out and try it.At what point,and what indication do I look for to tell me to shut it down?Lake water is under 90 by now.
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Joe,
When I need to test run a motor, I sometimes hang it on the boat and make a run to the ramp. ( a ramp that is not busy) I just back in leaving the boat on the trailer. Start the motor and put it thru the paces.
You should have a "pee" stream right away. If you don't something is wrong and will need futher checking. Your mechanic is right in that it should not get too hot to touch. It can be quite warm, some may say hot, but stiil should be able to hold your hand on it with out feeling like your going to suffer a burn.
When I need to test run a motor, I sometimes hang it on the boat and make a run to the ramp. ( a ramp that is not busy) I just back in leaving the boat on the trailer. Start the motor and put it thru the paces.
You should have a "pee" stream right away. If you don't something is wrong and will need futher checking. Your mechanic is right in that it should not get too hot to touch. It can be quite warm, some may say hot, but stiil should be able to hold your hand on it with out feeling like your going to suffer a burn.
Charlie S and Titan
Well-known member
I'd do the impeller and lower unit lube "just in case" - it is sort of like changing the oil first thing when I buy a used car. May not "need" it but I'd rather have the peace of mind.
I had motorcycle seize up on me because I didn't change the oil and it had sand in it (was a dual purpose bike so it had been trail ridden). Sand in the engine is a bad thing...
Cheap insurance.
Charlie
I had motorcycle seize up on me because I didn't change the oil and it had sand in it (was a dual purpose bike so it had been trail ridden). Sand in the engine is a bad thing...
Cheap insurance.
Charlie
Scott Gentry
Active member
im by no means a out board mechanic but i know my 25 horse merc has a therastat could thet be the same on yours? if so it could be stuckclosed mine and not allowing a pee hole.?.?.? Not sure just comenting and going stir crazy till this weekends opener
Lee Harker
Well-known member
Joe, I just had a thought...I was looking at the schematics on BRP's sight. The water pump is quite a bit higher than the pickup tube..when running in water the pump is a bit below waterline and when testing ,the waterpump needs to be below waterline as it doesn't really suck up water when running without a "prime"...try it this way and see what happens. I also didn't see a "plate" for the water inlet on the 76 model..it's a tube that is under and in back just above the prop..it shows a screen and plug. I also didn't see a pee hose or fitting that comes off the thermostat so it must dump into the mid section and exit the exaust relietf holes that are midway up the housing..that, I bet is why you were getting a "mist" out of there..the pump wasn't submerged and it was trying to pull water up but not getting a good "prime".
Lee when I entered the model number 6504,the parts page listed it as a 1975 model.No matter.The schmatic did show an intake plate on the left side just above the cavitation plate.There is also a screen at the exhaust port,under the cavitation plate.Air pressure down the flexible tube on the right side of the engine didn't produce any blow out.No water in the cylinders when I pulled the plugs and turned it over.I'll try what you suggest.If it gets too hot,I'll shut it down and buy a impeller kit.There are no small holes on the back of the shaft,only one large hole that goes up about eight inches.I ran a dowel there and hit metal.I think the passage makes a 90deg turn there.Also the lower unit did not originate on this power head.It came from another motor,same year but maybe not based on the model number.Howard would know.
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Lee Harker
Well-known member
OK I see that plate now..it's called a water "bypass" plate. Look at number 22 or 23..that is the INTAKE screen...take it out and clean it..maybe that's where the mud dauber built it's nest.
http://epc.brp.com/default.aspx?lang=E&brands=skidoo,seadoo,atv,sportboat,ej
http://epc.brp.com/default.aspx?lang=E&brands=skidoo,seadoo,atv,sportboat,ej
Joe,
They do show a thermostat for this engine. There could be a blockage at that point or it may not be opening. See the schematic and check it out.
They do show a thermostat for this engine. There could be a blockage at that point or it may not be opening. See the schematic and check it out.
Joe,
This is a direct copy from BRP parts catalog.
This is for a 1975 Evinrude 6HP model number 6504R
I added the red text showing the location of the thermostat (item#22). The part number for this thermostat is #378065 if you need to replace it. The thermostat cap should be real easy to see once you know where to look.
I'd have to agree with Lee and say that you may not have an external "pee" stream like a lot of motors. I too think that the water just dumps out inside the mid-section once it leaves the power head.
I can't tell you just how to remove #24 (plug) to get to #23 the screen. You are on your own there, Maybe Tom Scholberg (sp?) will chime in.
Also I'm not quite sure about item#31 which they call a water bypass cover. If I were to guess, I would say the the water from the pump bypasses going to the power head and dumps out under this cover up until the point in time that the thermostat opens and lets the water thru to the power head. However, it seems if that is the case, the system would need some sort of pressure spring relief before it would bypass because more pressure would be required to push the water up to the power head when the thermostat opened and allowed the water to flow to the head. Kind of hard to explain but the water is going to take the path of least resistance regardless of if the thermostat is open or not.
This is a direct copy from BRP parts catalog.
This is for a 1975 Evinrude 6HP model number 6504R
I added the red text showing the location of the thermostat (item#22). The part number for this thermostat is #378065 if you need to replace it. The thermostat cap should be real easy to see once you know where to look.
I'd have to agree with Lee and say that you may not have an external "pee" stream like a lot of motors. I too think that the water just dumps out inside the mid-section once it leaves the power head.
I can't tell you just how to remove #24 (plug) to get to #23 the screen. You are on your own there, Maybe Tom Scholberg (sp?) will chime in.
Also I'm not quite sure about item#31 which they call a water bypass cover. If I were to guess, I would say the the water from the pump bypasses going to the power head and dumps out under this cover up until the point in time that the thermostat opens and lets the water thru to the power head. However, it seems if that is the case, the system would need some sort of pressure spring relief before it would bypass because more pressure would be required to push the water up to the power head when the thermostat opened and allowed the water to flow to the head. Kind of hard to explain but the water is going to take the path of least resistance regardless of if the thermostat is open or not.
Dave,thanks for the heads up on the thermostat.I had the exploded views up,but hadn't bothered to pull up the power head page.I talked to Howard and to
Ralph, (guy at parts) and we all agreed to take the thermostat out and check it in boiling water to see if it opens,then start the engine to see if water is being pumped
up to the thermostat bay without much airation.Change the impeller if there is too much air.Sounds logical to me.
I'll let y'all know how this comes out.
Wish I knew how to send info from other sites to this one,and send URLs .I know nothing about cut/paste,etc.
Ralph, (guy at parts) and we all agreed to take the thermostat out and check it in boiling water to see if it opens,then start the engine to see if water is being pumped
up to the thermostat bay without much airation.Change the impeller if there is too much air.Sounds logical to me.
I'll let y'all know how this comes out.
Wish I knew how to send info from other sites to this one,and send URLs .I know nothing about cut/paste,etc.
Lee Harker
Well-known member
Those thermostats typically open at 142 degrees. That a piece of thread and stick it in the thermastat..get a meat thermometer and heat your water up to 140-150 and see if it lets go the string..if it does it's working. Those things are pretty inexpensive so you may just want to buy a new one with all the gaskets and associated stuff. Dave, I was reading about that bypass cover on iboats, it has little holes in it to drain the water out of the leg and waterpump so you don't have to "burp" them.
Lee,I just ran a couple tests on the thermostat,with the string method.It opens consistantly around 150deg.My thermometer only goes to 130 so I'm guessing.I was unable to salvage the gasket,and the area was pretty rusted up.zI thought for sure the thermostat wouldn't work,but it opens every time.I'm on my way now to start the motor without the thermostat/cover to see if the pump is working.Did you see the price they want for that little thermostat?If you put one of these motors together from parts it would cost five grand,maybe more.Found a parts place in Texas that will cut (48"),and sell a cover seal for $52.50,plus shipping.Deal Huh?