labradoodle
- Thread starter kulsh
- Start date
leslie riggan
Well-known member
I saw a very nice labradoodle at the kennel when I had my dog trained. It was a very, very well mannered dog with enough drive and enthusiasm to catch my attention. The only one I saw I liked her.
Mike Trudel
Well-known member
These cross bred dogs must be big in Michigan. I used to hunt near Three Rivers for pheasant when I was in college, and the local rage was "pointnys". An English pointer/brittany mix. They wanted the great nose of the pointer,the size, coat, and range of a brittany, with a pointer tail.
There is certainly a good number of various retreiver breeds including the poodle available. I have seen a number of poodles at hunt test and they do a decent job.
Trying to reinvent the wheel seems like a low percentage approach imho!
TimJ
Well-known member
Search out a breeder of hunting poodles. I've never heard of someone breeding a good hunting lab to a good hunting poodle, mostly because good poodles are few and far between and those breeders probably wouldn't cross them.
I have a bit of a pet peeve about these fad designer dogs. Despite what they say this is not how new breeds are developed. That takes a lot of serious inbreeding not just one out-cross.
Here's poodle breeder I found with a quick search http://www.lakelandhuntingpoodles.com/
Also you could look at pudelpointers, and they are not simply a pointer crossed with a poodle like some labradoodle breeders might try to tell you. They are suppose to shed a little less then most dogs.
My $.02
Tim
I have a bit of a pet peeve about these fad designer dogs. Despite what they say this is not how new breeds are developed. That takes a lot of serious inbreeding not just one out-cross.
Here's poodle breeder I found with a quick search http://www.lakelandhuntingpoodles.com/
Also you could look at pudelpointers, and they are not simply a pointer crossed with a poodle like some labradoodle breeders might try to tell you. They are suppose to shed a little less then most dogs.
My $.02
Tim
Brian Glock
Member
I have a Pudelpointer and couldn't be happier. Its a lousy name that miss represents the dog.
About 1870 some folks in Germany crossed 70 or so English pointers with 7 German Water Poodles (no longer in existance). This origianal beeding stock is what all of the Pudelpointers of today came from. Therefore, it is not a designer dog like a labradoodle, goldendoodle, or cockapoos.
My Pudelpointer is a great dog that doesn't shed much, is a joy in the house, very inteligent, and has great drive in the field. All this and he is only 6 months old.
If you are interested, check out www.cedarwoodgundogs.com for info. Bob Farris is the leading breader of Pudelpointers in the US. Also feel free to drop me a line if you want to talk more about them.
Cheers!
About 1870 some folks in Germany crossed 70 or so English pointers with 7 German Water Poodles (no longer in existance). This origianal beeding stock is what all of the Pudelpointers of today came from. Therefore, it is not a designer dog like a labradoodle, goldendoodle, or cockapoos.
My Pudelpointer is a great dog that doesn't shed much, is a joy in the house, very inteligent, and has great drive in the field. All this and he is only 6 months old.
If you are interested, check out www.cedarwoodgundogs.com for info. Bob Farris is the leading breader of Pudelpointers in the US. Also feel free to drop me a line if you want to talk more about them.
Cheers!
Dave Shady Larsen
Well-known member
Ok I cant resist, Gordy is in the background chuckling his black labrador butt off....... but do they make PINK neoprene vests
for the doodles?
so sorry couldnt resist.
A guy I know has one but is wife wont let it go hunting. There are some bad breeders out there just mixing to get the big $$
for the dogs. But thats the same with all breeders and people who just want to have pups to make the $$$.
Best of luck on your search.
for the doodles?
so sorry couldnt resist.
A guy I know has one but is wife wont let it go hunting. There are some bad breeders out there just mixing to get the big $$
for the dogs. But thats the same with all breeders and people who just want to have pups to make the $$$.
Best of luck on your search.
Mike
Well-known member
Speaking of cat shit...... I remember when my lab came over to me on the couch and licked me square in the mouth. I was taking a nap... and when she did that I woke up and was petting her on her muzzle when I felt something odd around her gum line. I opened my sleepy eyes and she had kittty litter all around her mouth like a friggin milk mustach or something! Its wierd ... never got mad at her for eating cat shit...took it out on the cat. She's past now ... sure do miss that dog! Think maybe in the spring we'll be looking for a new pup, but one that doesn't have POODLE affixed to it in any way. I think somebody's male lab got loose and made a little visit to the neighbor's poodle and ....... VIOLA...... labradoodle.
Thanks for the memories,
Mike
Thanks for the memories,
Mike
Ken R
Active member
My neighbor has a goldendoodle thats 2 and just got a second. I tried some retrieving tests when the first was little. No desire at all. Just not interested. The first looks like a very large poodle. The second at 10 weeks looks like it favors the golden side of the family. Nice dogs but not hunters in my opinion. Look at the American Water Spaniel or a Boykin. You won't notice the little bit they shed.
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My sister has one and she loves it. Lola is a great dog and she loves the water. My sister keeps a big boat at Mac & Raes next to Selfridge AFB on Lake St. Claire. Lola just loves being on the boat. She will retrieve all day long and has never had a bit of training, she just did it. Loves to go out to Muskamoot and hang out in the raft-up too. Don;t know about shedding, but she is a big dog. Well behaved nowthat she is not a puppy!
Kenneth Farris
New member
I honestly don't mean to knock any one elses dog. The 'doodle is a designer crossbreed that was designed to do one thing. The non-allergenic properties of the coat was supposed to fill the need for those who have such allergies. There were never meant to be " Retrievers". I have seen them hunted. But I have also seen Boxers, Collies, and other non retrievers used as well. The question is why would you? Generally 'doodles have not been bred from "field" lines and cost more money than a well bred Lab. I don't see any "retrieving" advantage. JMHO
Brian Glock
Member
Went to look up some info on "Doodles". Most of the versitile breeds of hunting dogs out there (giffons, wirehairs, pudelpointers) have poodle in their genes. These crosses took place over 100 years ago when men in Germany were refining the breads to their exact hunting needs. So, some breeds crossed with poodles have produced some amazing hunting breeds, however, many folks these days producing the labradoodles etc. are not breeding for the needs of a hunter. If you want something with poodle in it, take a look at the versitile breeds.
A piece that I pulled of the web on wirehairs.
"Most of the early wirehaired Pointers represented a combination of Griffon, Stichelhaar (both mixtures of Pointer, Foxhound, Pudelpointer, and Polish water dog), Pudelpointer (a cross of Poodle and Pointer) and German Shorthair. The Germans preferred an extra-rugged hunter capable of working on any kind of game on any terrain to a specialized hunting breed. They continued to breed the distinctive traits of Pointer, Foxhound, and Poodle until they had created what is today the German Wirehair, a constitutionally tough, courageous breed who pointed and retrieved equally well on land and in water."
A piece that I pulled of the web on wirehairs.
"Most of the early wirehaired Pointers represented a combination of Griffon, Stichelhaar (both mixtures of Pointer, Foxhound, Pudelpointer, and Polish water dog), Pudelpointer (a cross of Poodle and Pointer) and German Shorthair. The Germans preferred an extra-rugged hunter capable of working on any kind of game on any terrain to a specialized hunting breed. They continued to breed the distinctive traits of Pointer, Foxhound, and Poodle until they had created what is today the German Wirehair, a constitutionally tough, courageous breed who pointed and retrieved equally well on land and in water."
Tom Wall
Well-known member
I'll second looking for a poodle with hunting experience/hunt test titles. I know there have been a few poodles recently that have AKC Hunt Test titles. I'm not sure about HRC. About 8 or 9 years ago I judged a Minature poodle that was very good. He was a dog I'd hunt with. He had the best nose of the dogs I judged. Unfortunately, it got him in trouble in the test, he was scenting bird scent from the day before, and was not able to recover. None of the other dogs we judged picked up the scent from the day before. His name was Percy.
My daughter has a toy poodle that is as much a dog as any dog I've had. My daughter wants her to be more of a house pet so I haven't been able to take her hunting. She'd be a great dog for woodcock. She weighs about 10 lbs. and could easily get into spots bigger dogs will struggle with. I have taken her to a local park that has a couple of old gravels pits. She loved to chase the Killdeer!
Tom
My daughter has a toy poodle that is as much a dog as any dog I've had. My daughter wants her to be more of a house pet so I haven't been able to take her hunting. She'd be a great dog for woodcock. She weighs about 10 lbs. and could easily get into spots bigger dogs will struggle with. I have taken her to a local park that has a couple of old gravels pits. She loved to chase the Killdeer!
Tom
Nick Wansha
Active member
Some interesting reading here about working Poodles http://www.vipoodle.org/docs/WPindex.html
Also,a great looking titled poodle here http://working-retriever.com/photogal/poodles/bmpie.html
Word of advice - If you want a hunting dog, try to stick to an established breed with a proven hunting line - otherwise, you will likely get a nice family pet for the next 12 years and will likely get another one to do the hunting with you.
Me, I am partial to the little brown dogs that love to please. http://video.yahoo.com/video/play?vid=1776362
Also,a great looking titled poodle here http://working-retriever.com/photogal/poodles/bmpie.html
Word of advice - If you want a hunting dog, try to stick to an established breed with a proven hunting line - otherwise, you will likely get a nice family pet for the next 12 years and will likely get another one to do the hunting with you.
Me, I am partial to the little brown dogs that love to please. http://video.yahoo.com/video/play?vid=1776362
Dan B in MN
Member
Agreed! If you want a retriever to hunt with that doesn't shed (or sheds less) look for a poodle from parents that hunt. They are not real common, but they're out there. And like others have pointed out, the labradoodle and goldendoodle crosses (not breeds) are generally overpriced designer dogs, and I would doubt you'll find many at all the have any hunting stock in their background on either side. I prefer labs myself, but a poodle from good hunting stock should work out fine, that is what they were originally bred for. Good luck!
Jason Gillette
New member
Ok – It’s not my intention with what I’m about to type to offend anyone (all though I know I may) I hope to lay out where I’m coming from and welcome being told how I’m wrong about this whole thing so here goes
The heart of the controversy, in my opinion, around the labradoodle or Goldendoodle or any other “designer breed” is that may people who came before us and many of us today are deeply involved in making an existing breed better. Better can mean different things to different people but it almost always involves improving the breed via a standard, competition or identifying health issues and breeding to avoid if not eliminate them. The problem with the designer breeds is that many people who are advertising and selling them are “marketing” that the “Doodle” will have all the traits of both breeds that buyers want and none of the traits that the buyer doesn’t want. The sad truth is that genetics’ don’t work like that. You can not possibly get a consistent result from a mixed breed. Some traits maybe be expressed from a dominant gene but there is most likely going to be very little consistency – WHICH IS WHY PEOPLE, GENERATIONS AGO, STARTED PUREBREEDS!
These mixed breeds may end up to be the best/nicest dog a person will ever have BUT so could a dog from the animal shelter that is a mix. There’s nothing wrong with a mix breed but to “sell” it as a better/improved version of the sire and dam’s original breeds is ridiculous.
The reason a Labrador retriever, Golden, Chessy or Poodle is a recognizable type of dog with known traits is that it’s is the product of generations of selective breeding with a goal/standard in mind.
The real problem is not about these doodles being good or nice dogs the problem is in the shameless marketing of them. MANY of the quick buck puppy mill type breeders out there are the producers of these mixed beeds. Because it’s easy – NO RECORDS, NO HISTORY, NO GOVERNING CLUBS, NO STANDARDS, and NO COMPETITIONS.
How does someone know what they are getting? Even if they look at the two parents how do they know what they’ll end up with? This unknown creates an opportunity for the unscrupulous person to just tell the buyer what ever they need to to sell the puppy.
They maybe very nice dogs and thank God we live in a land where I can’t tell you (or the HSUS or the AKC for that matter) what to do but just remember – IT’S A MIXED BREED EVERY DOG IS GOING TO BE A MIX OF A MESS OF GENETICS!
Let me finish with saying - I'm NOT saying all the breeders of these mixes are unscrupulous, but the situation lends its self to the the profit minded breeder.
The heart of the controversy, in my opinion, around the labradoodle or Goldendoodle or any other “designer breed” is that may people who came before us and many of us today are deeply involved in making an existing breed better. Better can mean different things to different people but it almost always involves improving the breed via a standard, competition or identifying health issues and breeding to avoid if not eliminate them. The problem with the designer breeds is that many people who are advertising and selling them are “marketing” that the “Doodle” will have all the traits of both breeds that buyers want and none of the traits that the buyer doesn’t want. The sad truth is that genetics’ don’t work like that. You can not possibly get a consistent result from a mixed breed. Some traits maybe be expressed from a dominant gene but there is most likely going to be very little consistency – WHICH IS WHY PEOPLE, GENERATIONS AGO, STARTED PUREBREEDS!
These mixed breeds may end up to be the best/nicest dog a person will ever have BUT so could a dog from the animal shelter that is a mix. There’s nothing wrong with a mix breed but to “sell” it as a better/improved version of the sire and dam’s original breeds is ridiculous.
The reason a Labrador retriever, Golden, Chessy or Poodle is a recognizable type of dog with known traits is that it’s is the product of generations of selective breeding with a goal/standard in mind.
The real problem is not about these doodles being good or nice dogs the problem is in the shameless marketing of them. MANY of the quick buck puppy mill type breeders out there are the producers of these mixed beeds. Because it’s easy – NO RECORDS, NO HISTORY, NO GOVERNING CLUBS, NO STANDARDS, and NO COMPETITIONS.
How does someone know what they are getting? Even if they look at the two parents how do they know what they’ll end up with? This unknown creates an opportunity for the unscrupulous person to just tell the buyer what ever they need to to sell the puppy.
They maybe very nice dogs and thank God we live in a land where I can’t tell you (or the HSUS or the AKC for that matter) what to do but just remember – IT’S A MIXED BREED EVERY DOG IS GOING TO BE A MIX OF A MESS OF GENETICS!
Let me finish with saying - I'm NOT saying all the breeders of these mixes are unscrupulous, but the situation lends its self to the the profit minded breeder.
I have often wondered the same about the huntability of this relatively new breed. You have two breeds put together that each offer great history in duck hunting. One would think this could potentially be a great mix. I work with someone that breeds his "Doodle" and have spoke to him about the huntability of the dog. He does not hunt nor does he know of someone that hunts with one. So I have nothing to offer there.
I would have to agree with nicks advise. There are many great hunting dogs from many different breeds. You can't go wrong by following good hunting lines, whatever breed you may choose. My first hunting dog was a chocolate lab with no hunting parents in his recent bloodlines. I, and others thought he was a great dog and a great hunter. After I lost him I got into the hunting and field trials line of labs. Without trying not to take any credit away from my first dog, cause you just don't do that to your first dog. I must say I learned the difference between a great hunter and an outstanding hunter, they have been bred just for there exceptional hunting abilities.
Good luck in your search for a new hunting partner!
I would have to agree with nicks advise. There are many great hunting dogs from many different breeds. You can't go wrong by following good hunting lines, whatever breed you may choose. My first hunting dog was a chocolate lab with no hunting parents in his recent bloodlines. I, and others thought he was a great dog and a great hunter. After I lost him I got into the hunting and field trials line of labs. Without trying not to take any credit away from my first dog, cause you just don't do that to your first dog. I must say I learned the difference between a great hunter and an outstanding hunter, they have been bred just for there exceptional hunting abilities.
Good luck in your search for a new hunting partner!