South Bay Spa Treatment
- Thread starter Steve Sanford
- Start date
Steve Sanford
Well-known member
Good morning, Rob~
I am, indeed, a devotee of 3M 5200 - but am not an expert. I believe a member here works/worked for 3M and would know definitively.
My approach has always been to just stack up work that requires it so I will waste little or none. When a tube does set up near the nozzle, I have been known to cut through the tube with a knife so I could spoon out the good stuff with a putty knife.
A friend just told me, though, that another approach is to freeze it between uses. I have not tried that.
All the best,
SJS
I am, indeed, a devotee of 3M 5200 - but am not an expert. I believe a member here works/worked for 3M and would know definitively.
My approach has always been to just stack up work that requires it so I will waste little or none. When a tube does set up near the nozzle, I have been known to cut through the tube with a knife so I could spoon out the good stuff with a putty knife.
A friend just told me, though, that another approach is to freeze it between uses. I have not tried that.
All the best,
SJS
Steve Sanford
Well-known member
Bill et al~
Here is one of the keepers for the nav light bolts. I used 7/32 I. D. rubber hose from NAPA and used ShoeGoo to attach lengths of the "vinyl" decoy line (I don't really know what it is - just had some from others' decoys). Each will be fastened near its light so it'll not get lost. The 7/32 hose has just the right amount of friction over the 6 mm threads.
Another task completed is adding to the existing cowling/spray shield.
I started by measuring the camber in the existing cowling and making a jig to that curve. Here you get a sneak peek at the new flap boards, too.....
Here is the jig. It's about 2 inches larger in both dimensions so I can trim excess 'glass once it has cured. I used wax paper to prevent sticking but need to get a supply of cellophane on hand for these small molding projects.
I used what I had on hand for 'glass: some FabMat, heavy woven roving, 1.5 ounce mat and cloth. I used polyester resin - from the local hardware store - because a) most mat is chemically incompatible with epoxy resin, and b) epoxy resin needs more protection from UV light.
Because I do not want the "aroma" of polyester resin permeating my shop for the next year, I waited for a sunny, 70-degree day. I laid it up in the shade then moved it to the south side of my shop to cure in the sun: hard as a rock within 90 minutes. I trimmed it to final shape with bandsaw, table saw and belt sander. Then, I faired and scuffed it with 60-grit on my orbital sander.
I had hoped to get away with a single jig - and laminated the upper thatch rail on the same jig. No go. As usual, I had springback on the rail when I removed it from the jig - but too much to force onto the new 'glass cowling extension.
Here is the extension - another 5 inches - set in 5200 and bolted on.
I made another jig - just a single piece of salvaged pine - with an additional inch of crown to accommodate the springback. I used cellophane packing tape to prevent sticking.
I used 3 layers of 1/8-inch Philippine Mahogany. Spring clamps suffice - and prevent squeezing out all of the epoxy.
Here I am just measuring it for fit - so I can epoxy on 3 spacer blocks.
Machine screws and 5200 fasten the upper thatch rail.
Here is the first coat of FME Dead Grass Green.
All the best,
SJS
Here is one of the keepers for the nav light bolts. I used 7/32 I. D. rubber hose from NAPA and used ShoeGoo to attach lengths of the "vinyl" decoy line (I don't really know what it is - just had some from others' decoys). Each will be fastened near its light so it'll not get lost. The 7/32 hose has just the right amount of friction over the 6 mm threads.
Another task completed is adding to the existing cowling/spray shield.
I started by measuring the camber in the existing cowling and making a jig to that curve. Here you get a sneak peek at the new flap boards, too.....
Here is the jig. It's about 2 inches larger in both dimensions so I can trim excess 'glass once it has cured. I used wax paper to prevent sticking but need to get a supply of cellophane on hand for these small molding projects.
I used what I had on hand for 'glass: some FabMat, heavy woven roving, 1.5 ounce mat and cloth. I used polyester resin - from the local hardware store - because a) most mat is chemically incompatible with epoxy resin, and b) epoxy resin needs more protection from UV light.
Because I do not want the "aroma" of polyester resin permeating my shop for the next year, I waited for a sunny, 70-degree day. I laid it up in the shade then moved it to the south side of my shop to cure in the sun: hard as a rock within 90 minutes. I trimmed it to final shape with bandsaw, table saw and belt sander. Then, I faired and scuffed it with 60-grit on my orbital sander.
I had hoped to get away with a single jig - and laminated the upper thatch rail on the same jig. No go. As usual, I had springback on the rail when I removed it from the jig - but too much to force onto the new 'glass cowling extension.
Here is the extension - another 5 inches - set in 5200 and bolted on.
I made another jig - just a single piece of salvaged pine - with an additional inch of crown to accommodate the springback. I used cellophane packing tape to prevent sticking.
I used 3 layers of 1/8-inch Philippine Mahogany. Spring clamps suffice - and prevent squeezing out all of the epoxy.
Here I am just measuring it for fit - so I can epoxy on 3 spacer blocks.
Machine screws and 5200 fasten the upper thatch rail.
Here is the first coat of FME Dead Grass Green.
All the best,
SJS
Steve Sanford
Well-known member
Carl~
That's great to hear! I am planning to use them on my own Sneakbox - when I rehab it next spring (?).
Did you use the suction cups - or some other method?
All the best,
SJS
That's great to hear! I am planning to use them on my own Sneakbox - when I rehab it next spring (?).
Did you use the suction cups - or some other method?
All the best,
SJS
MIne came with a clamp which didn't really work with my boat. I removed the clamp and used the bolt to attach it to the bow of my boat, similar to what you did. I will try to get some pics.
I still have an old "flashlight on a stick" for the stern light, I need to replace it with an LED one too.
I still have an old "flashlight on a stick" for the stern light, I need to replace it with an LED one too.
Steve Sanford
Well-known member
All~
I will be taking a break for a few days - lots of projects on Long Island, including Sunday's South Shore Waterfowlers Duckboat Show & Waterfowl Festival at Cedar Beach in Babylon.
I wanted to get the final paint on the exterior - so it can harden off over several days before I begin to thatch it next week. I will take a bunch more "portraits" - probably outside - before I cover it with salt hay.
This gives a sense of the flat hull sections.
I have already begun work on the next episodes: floorboards and canvas.
All the best,
SJS
I will be taking a break for a few days - lots of projects on Long Island, including Sunday's South Shore Waterfowlers Duckboat Show & Waterfowl Festival at Cedar Beach in Babylon.
I wanted to get the final paint on the exterior - so it can harden off over several days before I begin to thatch it next week. I will take a bunch more "portraits" - probably outside - before I cover it with salt hay.
This gives a sense of the flat hull sections.
I have already begun work on the next episodes: floorboards and canvas.
All the best,
SJS
steve schrat
Member
looks amazing cant wait to see more pics .
Phil Eager
Well-known member
Steve, Backtracking to the motor board.... I never knew you could sand Calk. What type were you using. Latex, silicone or a 5200?
Thanks in advance, I've got a couple projects in mind.
Phil
Thanks in advance, I've got a couple projects in mind.
Phil
Capt Rich Geminski
Well-known member
Steve, will you be bringing the southbay down for the DB Show? Would like to see the improvements as I have one also.
Steve Sanford
Well-known member
Phil~
It's not something I do routinely - but trusted the flexible 3M 5200 to truly seal the 2 boards - over the long haul - than an epoxy/epoxy with fillers. The 5200 takes about a week to cure and, being "rubbery", is not a pleasure to sand. I had faired it quite smooth when applied so the need for sanding would be minimal.
Hope this helps!
SJS
It's not something I do routinely - but trusted the flexible 3M 5200 to truly seal the 2 boards - over the long haul - than an epoxy/epoxy with fillers. The 5200 takes about a week to cure and, being "rubbery", is not a pleasure to sand. I had faired it quite smooth when applied so the need for sanding would be minimal.
Hope this helps!
SJS
Steve Sanford
Well-known member
Rich~
The South Bay will stay up in Washington County 'til it's all done and thatched. I just hauled my Great South Bay Scooter down this morning - and will bring it to the Show on Sunday.
See you soon,
SJS
The South Bay will stay up in Washington County 'til it's all done and thatched. I just hauled my Great South Bay Scooter down this morning - and will bring it to the Show on Sunday.
See you soon,
SJS
Bill Abbate
Active member
Looks phenonomal, Steve. Can't wait to see her in person. Great work !! I'm going to have one of the nicest Southbays out there; thanks to all of your diligent efforts.
Steve Sanford
Well-known member
Bill et al~
Here's an update - starting with the floorboards. The floorboards are 1/2-inch plywood and come in 2 halves, port and starboard. They are fastened to each other but not to the floor. We wanted to chock the gas tank on them up forward, make it less slippery, and keep them from moving or pounding.
After removing them, my first job seems mostly aesthetic - giving their outer edges a nice "fair curve" - but it was also practical in that the corners had been touching the inner hull sides - and I was concerned about chafe.
I clamped one of my battens to the boards - then cut the long sweeping curve with my circular saw.
Each corner got a large radius.
All of the edges got rounded over with a router.
The oval holes will receive wooden turnbuttons - completed in a later post. Four turnbuttons will hold the floorboards in place.
The central area of the boards - where gunners stand - got a coat of epoxy then coarse sand.
This is a pad to support the Port-Aft turnbuton.
Chocks were screwed to the forward end of the floorboards to hold the gas tank in place. I was concerned that the spring coils on the hook might chafe the plastic tank - but they do not touch.
The aft side is hooked/unhooked when removing the tank - for filling, etc.
Here is a larger view - showing the non-skid (we hope!) and the access hole for pumping the bilge.
The flapboards are large frames to which bundles of Salt Hay and/ or Cordgrass will be lashed. As with the cowling, we were going for greater height - thus a better hide. Bill sits up whilst awaiting the Unsuspecting Fowl......
The old blocks were falling apart AND we wanted the new boards to lay out just above level when they were opened - to provide a nice wide platform for decoys when setting out or picking up the rig. So, finding level and plumb were the first tasks.
Too fancy for a duckboat, but....I used some 2-inch Honduran Mahogany for the new blocks. The bottoms - cut off on the band saw - became the backing blocks below deck - properly beveled.
When installing, I made sure they were parallel so the hinges would work with minimal binding.
The original brass hinges were re-used. I had to "square" the holes to receive the new carriage bolts - and they were "reamed out" (with a 1/8" drill) for removable pins.
Plenty of 3M 5200 to bed the new blocks and the hinges.
The flapboards themselves were one of my Midnight Projects. In the shop at 1:30 AM - to turn some Phillipine Mahogany into light strong frames.
Here is some tarred, braided decoy line to hold the bundles of thatch. This is the view of the inside.
The thatch goes on the outside.
The line passes through the frame about every 12 inches - but there are no gaps.
The removable brass hinge pins - so the flapboards can be stowed inside during long transits or off-season - are kept on the 'boards with short lanyards.
We also needed a secure place for the pushpole when not in use. It will sit nicely between the coaming and the flapboards when the sides are down - as when you are tending stool - but I had to think of a way that worked with the 'boards both up and down. I used a system very similar to what I have on my own Sneakbox. But, because my 'Box does not have flapboards, I needed to move it from the starboard deck to the starboard flapboard.
The chock-and-bail are mounted on the inside of the starboard flapboard.
The forward "keeper" is a bail made from heavy galvanized wire covered with a length of rubber hose. It is made large so the helmsman - while standing at the tiller and under way - can poke the top of the pushpole through the bail.
The aft "keeper" is a more conventional chock. The standing helmsman can easily bend slightly - without letting go the tiller mind you - and place the lower part of the pole in the chock.
Quarter-inch shock cord holds it in place - and fits into its slot - another one-handed operation by the standing helmsman.
While gunning, it is secure but out of the way.
The most recent task was a real "bearcat" - as my Grandfather would say. What would have been very simple during construction was a real challenge with the aft bulkhead and flotation foam in place. But, thanks to help from my wife Susan - 43 years today since our first kiss! - it is now done - and done as it should be, with large backers behinds the nuts and washers to distribute the load.
I sanded the stainless handles with 150-grit so the paint would stick later on.
I took this photo after the handles were installed, but, the first step was cutting holes for 4-inch Beckson Deck Plates - then burrowing/tunneling/excavating through the foam to get a clear shot at the underside of the rear decks.
Here is everything drawn down into a bed of 3M 5200. Whew.....
No photo can show how this job was right at the limits of my reach. I wonder if I should have flipped the boat and worked upright from a chair - rather than writhing and wriggling ungracefully in the cockpit on my back......
Here is the port handle wiped and ready for paint.
And here is the first coat of FME #28. The handles will get at least one more coat.
I will re-fill the flotation foam and then install the Beckson Deck Plates next.
Almost ready for grassing - just a couple more details.......
All the best,
SJS
Here's an update - starting with the floorboards. The floorboards are 1/2-inch plywood and come in 2 halves, port and starboard. They are fastened to each other but not to the floor. We wanted to chock the gas tank on them up forward, make it less slippery, and keep them from moving or pounding.
After removing them, my first job seems mostly aesthetic - giving their outer edges a nice "fair curve" - but it was also practical in that the corners had been touching the inner hull sides - and I was concerned about chafe.
I clamped one of my battens to the boards - then cut the long sweeping curve with my circular saw.
Each corner got a large radius.
All of the edges got rounded over with a router.
The oval holes will receive wooden turnbuttons - completed in a later post. Four turnbuttons will hold the floorboards in place.
The central area of the boards - where gunners stand - got a coat of epoxy then coarse sand.
This is a pad to support the Port-Aft turnbuton.
Chocks were screwed to the forward end of the floorboards to hold the gas tank in place. I was concerned that the spring coils on the hook might chafe the plastic tank - but they do not touch.
The aft side is hooked/unhooked when removing the tank - for filling, etc.
Here is a larger view - showing the non-skid (we hope!) and the access hole for pumping the bilge.
The flapboards are large frames to which bundles of Salt Hay and/ or Cordgrass will be lashed. As with the cowling, we were going for greater height - thus a better hide. Bill sits up whilst awaiting the Unsuspecting Fowl......
The old blocks were falling apart AND we wanted the new boards to lay out just above level when they were opened - to provide a nice wide platform for decoys when setting out or picking up the rig. So, finding level and plumb were the first tasks.
Too fancy for a duckboat, but....I used some 2-inch Honduran Mahogany for the new blocks. The bottoms - cut off on the band saw - became the backing blocks below deck - properly beveled.
When installing, I made sure they were parallel so the hinges would work with minimal binding.
The original brass hinges were re-used. I had to "square" the holes to receive the new carriage bolts - and they were "reamed out" (with a 1/8" drill) for removable pins.
Plenty of 3M 5200 to bed the new blocks and the hinges.
The flapboards themselves were one of my Midnight Projects. In the shop at 1:30 AM - to turn some Phillipine Mahogany into light strong frames.
Here is some tarred, braided decoy line to hold the bundles of thatch. This is the view of the inside.
The thatch goes on the outside.
The line passes through the frame about every 12 inches - but there are no gaps.
The removable brass hinge pins - so the flapboards can be stowed inside during long transits or off-season - are kept on the 'boards with short lanyards.
We also needed a secure place for the pushpole when not in use. It will sit nicely between the coaming and the flapboards when the sides are down - as when you are tending stool - but I had to think of a way that worked with the 'boards both up and down. I used a system very similar to what I have on my own Sneakbox. But, because my 'Box does not have flapboards, I needed to move it from the starboard deck to the starboard flapboard.
The chock-and-bail are mounted on the inside of the starboard flapboard.
The forward "keeper" is a bail made from heavy galvanized wire covered with a length of rubber hose. It is made large so the helmsman - while standing at the tiller and under way - can poke the top of the pushpole through the bail.
The aft "keeper" is a more conventional chock. The standing helmsman can easily bend slightly - without letting go the tiller mind you - and place the lower part of the pole in the chock.
Quarter-inch shock cord holds it in place - and fits into its slot - another one-handed operation by the standing helmsman.
While gunning, it is secure but out of the way.
The most recent task was a real "bearcat" - as my Grandfather would say. What would have been very simple during construction was a real challenge with the aft bulkhead and flotation foam in place. But, thanks to help from my wife Susan - 43 years today since our first kiss! - it is now done - and done as it should be, with large backers behinds the nuts and washers to distribute the load.
I sanded the stainless handles with 150-grit so the paint would stick later on.
I took this photo after the handles were installed, but, the first step was cutting holes for 4-inch Beckson Deck Plates - then burrowing/tunneling/excavating through the foam to get a clear shot at the underside of the rear decks.
Here is everything drawn down into a bed of 3M 5200. Whew.....
No photo can show how this job was right at the limits of my reach. I wonder if I should have flipped the boat and worked upright from a chair - rather than writhing and wriggling ungracefully in the cockpit on my back......
Here is the port handle wiped and ready for paint.
And here is the first coat of FME #28. The handles will get at least one more coat.
I will re-fill the flotation foam and then install the Beckson Deck Plates next.
Almost ready for grassing - just a couple more details.......
All the best,
SJS
Bill Abbate
Active member
Love all of the work. It's really coming together. Please paint the gas tank for me. Thank you.
My compliments on the design forethought as well as the execution, Steve. Simple aspects of a duck boat when you view them all together, but each reflects a great deal of forethought and design effort, as well as craftsmanship to individualize this boat for its task!
Steve Sanford
Well-known member
Good morning, Bill~
Something like this?
I had some Rustoleum Camo spray paint in the shop. The label says it will stick to plastic. I scuffed the tank with sandpaper, wiped it with acetone, then let the spray fly (after plugging and masking the 2 caps). Label says the paint takes 5 to 7 days to fully cure when used on plastic. I will be curious to hear how it wears over the season.
The rest of today will find me raking and hauling leaves - just about evreything is down now.
All the best,
SJS
Something like this?
I had some Rustoleum Camo spray paint in the shop. The label says it will stick to plastic. I scuffed the tank with sandpaper, wiped it with acetone, then let the spray fly (after plugging and masking the 2 caps). Label says the paint takes 5 to 7 days to fully cure when used on plastic. I will be curious to hear how it wears over the season.
The rest of today will find me raking and hauling leaves - just about evreything is down now.
All the best,
SJS
Bill Abbate
Active member
That's perfect Steve. Thank you.
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