how big a hoop do you need for a "blanket" Beaver THIS big?

I certain would try by hand first. Depending on where the trap is on the dogs head, you may not have much time. With your dog in it, it's going to be difficult at best. I don't know, I carry a coon hunters dog lead with a length of chain on the end that might work better than a rope. One of those things I haven't done in a long, long time and should really reaquaint myself with I guess.

Any of the conibears of 220 or larger are significant dangers to any dog and one shouldn't be thought of as any less dangerous than another.
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As far as risk, it is low probability, but man o' man, you wouldn't want to sit there trying to figure it out if it ever happened.

When you say difficult to work with do you mean because the dog would be fighting you or just because having something in the trap makes it harder to open? I wouldn't want to count on it, but there should be a fair bit of time (although it woudl seem like forever) that the dog would be immobile that you could work and still get it back in teh end.

Scary stuff to watch a dog in a situation where it may die.

T
 
Yes, it is a bit more difficult handling a trap with any animal in it - even a dead animal. With a struggling 80-100 lb dog in it the difficulty would rise as well as your anxiety. Not something I ever want to do myself but I think the potential for it happening is quite remote.
 
Yes, it is a bit more difficult handling a trap with any animal in it - even a dead animal. With a struggling 80-100 lb dog in it the difficulty would rise as well as your anxiety. Not something I ever want to do myself but I think the potential for it happening is quite remote.
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No doubt low odds.
 
Jack,

It's interesting what dogs find and roll in. I've had dogs that loved coon crap and wore it like a badge of honor. Others loved dead fish. I don't think my current chessie has ever rolled in anything - it's weird. It's like it never crosses his mind to roll in it ...........he'd rather eat it.

Regarding leg hold traps and dogs. I've caught my own dogs, other peoples dogs, cats plus my own fingers in just about every trap I've used and haven't hurt anything other than a bruise. They are designed to "hold" an animal, not break anything. Usually on a dog, fox, coyote, etc. the trap will end up on the toes and will hold very securily until the animal is released. I don't worry about them.
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Pete,
Thanks for the info. I never did trapping so I really didn't know what damage could have occured. It's great to feel at ease in new areas that I visit.

I think you may need to give the dog some breath mints :0).

The last time Chance did the "roll" he wreaked so bad. I was fortunate to have heavy rains approaching and made him sit outside in the deluge for about 10 minutes. I should have taken pictures, because he was listening so well to the "Sit command" regardless of the rain. My buddy said I'd need to shampoo him down, but mother nature is amazing.

-Jack
 
For yourself or anyone who is concerned about traps. Go out and buy one or two different sizes and see for yourself. Try them out, snap your fingers, set and reset, etc. Experience is the best teacher. Traps are not expensive.
 
in leg hold traps.....tasty little pieces of bait or scent to lure them in and all of that......then one day was at the Big R with Dave Parks and they had a hole isle of traps....we stopped and I picked one of the underspring traps....big enough for a fox, strong enough for a man, (no wait thats deoderant).....I set it just to see how hard it was and as I locked it open Dave stuck his fingers in it....SNAP.....trap is hanging from two of Daves fingers and he isn't screaming or shouting or anything....just standing there grinning.....

I know nothing about traps beyond setting them and disliking the idea of it being my hand in the thing.......he extracted himself and then showed me the "offset jaws".....ahhhhhh soooooooooo.....I'm starting to catch on....move down the line and pick up a double long spring, Coyote size, (I think it was a three), and he shows me how you use your thigh to help set it.....takes a couple of times to get it right but I get the pan locked hold it by one spring and say..."stick your hand in this one smartass"......HE DID.......THAWWWAAACCCCKKKKK.....the man's crazy.....certifibly so....

I'm sure it didn't tickle but "many wounds" just grinned......

Point of the story being that while I'm sure that it wouldn't be pleasant I don't "fear" the thought of my dog being caught in a "non-connibear" trap anymore.....part of that was the "lesson" that Dave gave me and the other part is the fact that as a "responsible dog owner" I don't let my dogs run wild in the woods. I'm with them, and usually within sight of them almost constantly when I'm hunting so if they shold get into trouble with a trap of that type the won't be in it long......

Connibears do scare me since they are set in water in natrual places where animals enter the water.....not a long stretch of the imagination to think that a dog could cross water in exactly the same place that would be the place an Otter or a Beaver would access the water.....or that he'd be attracted to a "scent mound" set......(Buddy for instance adored Otter crap and never passed up an opportunity to visit a Beaver scent mound)...

That said I have a greater fear of "broken glass", "human crap" left by irresponsible hunters who can't be bother to bury it, Skunks, Porcupines, rusted metal from old equipment/buildings, open well holes, and idiots who might shoot them, or me......

I'm as well prepared as I can make myself as far as knowing how to get them out of one the things should he get in it, and I don't just "cut em loose for a run in the woods"....and short of staying home and biting my fingernails to the cuticle thats about all that I can do because I'm sure not going to let the threat of "lightening striking" keep me home.....

Steve
 
Bet it leaves a mark.....

(BTW the picture was taken in Montana--released "unharmed" and I'm sure it suffered no trauma during the three tdays it was wearing the nose jewelery..

ILO of the recent "trapping post" this is meant to be nothing more than an "interesting photo" and in no way denotes and opinion, one way or the oter, about trapping, its value, or lack thereof, or how many ducks it will save.....


Steve
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Nothing like being non commital on a pot stirring post you started. "interesting photo"
 
we had a wolverine season in the mountains east of town for the first time in decades. Lots of people with trapping licenses and no trapping skills went out and made sets along ski and hiking trails. Three or four dogs dead by the end of the season. More dogs were taken than wolverines. Some of the dogs were alive for hours while the owners tried to get the traps off them, but with no knowledge of how a conibear worked they just made things worse for their dogs. Needless to say due to the end results the state did not open up the season again. The biologists were against it from the start anyway.

Most of you have probably seen this link. It was passed around last year by the media up here.
http://www.terrierman.com/traprelease.htm

The easiest position for you to get the trap off may put the dog at a really painful angle so practicing is only part of the solution.

My ex-wife's ex-boyfriend had his dog caught in a leg hold two months ago out on the Coastal Refuge. They were both surprised to find a trap next to a ski trail. The dog was not harmed, but it took about 20 minutes to get the trap off due to the soft snow. Every time he stood on the springs the trap just pushed deeper down. Eventually he carried the dog over to a log to get the trap off. After that I am sure he broke a couple of state laws about trapping gear.

This is what the AK F&G folks have about sharing the trails used by trappers and dog walkers. The AK Trappers Asso. made a DVD and will send it out for viewing for 30 days. They also sell it if you want to keep a copy.
http://www.wildlife.alaska.gov/index.cfm?adfg=trapping.sharing

One of the interresting things about dog owners in Anchorage is that the city rules and the rules for the state park to the east of us is that you must have a leash with you if your dog is off leash. I seldom see this happening. In the case of the wolverine sets a couple of the owners were cross country skiing and they didn't even have boot laces to use (velcro and buckles on their fancy boots). Maybe a strap from a backpack, but if they don't know how to work the trap then nothing will work for them.
 
a DONKEY? add insult to injury....poor elk....sore nose and now called a donkey....

Problem is the donkey "might" have been smart enough not to stick his nose in the conibear....
 
All good points and I'm glad you were able to get educated by someone who knew what he was doing. I wish everyone who has the potential to come across a trap in the field would go through the same class. I snapped a #1 on my fingers after Christmas dinner one year "just screwing around" and I thought my B-in-law was going to faint dead away.

Here's the thing about Conibears. They were designed to be "body gripping" traps or in the case of really big Beaver - head gripping. They are most effective in the water and that is the ONLY place that is valid for a 330 certainly ethically and most places, legally (lower 48, I don't know about Alaska). For a dog to be in serious danger he would have to stick his head in one and that is highly unlikely in the water. Now, some people in the past have used conibears (220's) on trails for coon for example and in that case they are pretty close to the ground and a dog will generally jump over them and we have been advised in the past to put a stick over the top of the set as a "jump stick". That type of set is NOT recommended and in many places is not legal. The other type of set where they are used is called a bucket set where the conibear, usually a 220, is set inside a bucket and the bucket is inverted and positioned maybe 6-8" above the ground. That is just enough to allow a coon to get in but excludes dogs. It would seem to me that the vast majority of waterfowl dogs will be big enough to naturally avoid a trap though a small dog like a Beagle might get in trouble and in fact we lost our Beagle to a 220 years ago that was set on land.

As much as you don't want your dog in a trap, neither does the trapper. Most of us do what we can to eliminate that possibility as much as we can.
 
Pete, out of curiousity I reviewed the current AK regulations and they have set a size limit, but not a type restriction for the local unit. "Killer style traps" can not exceed 7 inches for the inside spread so that would limit conibears to the 220 or smaller sizes. They do not restrict conibears to water use only. These were changes made this season due to the issues last year with the dogs on the ski trails.

I also noticed something I missed when reviewing the regulations back when the ex's friend's dog was in a foot hold. That area is closed to all trapping. I did tell the guy back in December to report it to F&G so maybe something was done for the illegal set.
 
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