New MN gun control law takes affect today. Question

Mark W

Mark W

Well-known member
Today marks the beginning of the new gun control laws in MN. One of them I don't understand how it is going to be enforced and maybe someone has an answer.

It is now illegal for me to loan, for whatever purpose and for whatever length of time without filling out 4 pieces of documentation and going through a minimum of two agencies a gun to anyone.

So I'm am out duck hunting and I have a spare gun. I'm with a buddy who brings his own gun along but it malfunctions. Legally I cannot just give him my gun to finish up the hunt that day. Suppose I do lend him my spare gun and we are approached by a game warden. How is that game warden going to know who my spare gun belongs to? There is no registry in MN as it is against the law and a Federal gun registry does not exist. The only thing linking me to a certain gun is when I may have had a background check. That information is to not be given to law enforcement.

And I actually have a gun sold to me a long time ago when a private transaction was legal to do so without going through a FFL

So how does this now work?
 
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My best guess in this situation is that the only way is if one of the hunters admit to loaning a gun?? I would agree with you that I'm not sure there is any legal way for law enforcement to determine who actually owns the gun.
 
There is a similer law in WA. At the time it was enacted I was loaning my spare 870 to my bosses son for the season who was getting into duck hunting. It was understood that if he was asked that the simple answer is "it's mine". There is no paperwork for this gun since I bought it from a buddy 25 years ago as a spare. I have never been asked or met anybody who has been asked in the field who owns the guns that are being used. I don't know how it is suppoesd to work either.
 
In large measure, another example of crap laws designed to frustrate people who follow the law. But, possibly some good news for your hunting scenario. I tried to find the text of the law, without success. I did find some news articles. Check this link, it says there are exemptions within hunting parties and at shooting ranges at about paragraph 11. It is not the text of the law, but perhaps you should dig a little deeper.

https://www.mprnews.org/...YtTNNicaAoPHEALw_wcB
 
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Here's a link to the text of the law:

SF 1723 as introduced - 93rd Legislature (2023 - 2024) (mn.gov)

The text about loaning a firearm (waiver) says:

Sec. 16. [624.7136] FIREARM TRANSFERS; REQUIREMENTS.
Subdivision 1. Definition.
As used in this section, "transfer" has the meaning given in
section 624.712, subdivision 6, but does not include:
(1) the delivery of a firearm to a person for the purpose of repair, reconditioning, or
remodeling;
(2) a loan by a teacher to a student in a course designed to teach marksmanship or firearms
safety, in the presence of the instructor, if the course is approved by the commissioner of
public safety;
(3) a loan between persons lawfully engaged in hunting or target shooting if the loan is
intended for a period of no more than 30 days and both persons are licensed to possess
firearms;
(4) while hunting or trapping if the hunting or trapping is legal in all places where the
transferee possesses the firearm and the transferee holds a license to possess firearms and
all licenses or permits required for hunting or trapping;
(5) while in the actual presence of the transferor; provided that any transfer under this
clause is permitted only if the transferor has no reason to believe that the transferee is
prohibited by federal law from buying or possessing firearms or not entitled under state law
to possess firearms. If the transferee is under 18 years of age, it must be under direct
supervision and control of the transferor;
(6) a loan between peace officers, as defined in section 626.84; and
(7) a loan between employees or between the employer and an employee in a business
if the employee is required to carry a firearm by reason of employment and is the holder of
a valid permit to carry a pistol.

Basically you cannot "transfer" a firearm without background checks or license except under the above-listed conditions. Loaning a shotgun for hunting or shooting is okay.


I found the requirement for a license, and the requirement for liability insurance to be the more impactful piece of the legislation.


Both of these requirements go into effect January 1, 2024.
 
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Thanks for posting. Under line 4. It states both parties have to be licensed to posses a firearm. This may sound dumb but do hunting permits in Minnesota require you to be licensed firearm owner?

You invite friend to try duck hunting, but he does not own gun so you want to loan him your shotgun. Seems like a barrier to entry if people don't want to go through hassle of getting licensed to own a firearm.

Rick
 
Richard Lathrop said:
Thanks for posting. Under line 4. It states both parties have to be licensed to posses a firearm. This may sound dumb but do hunting permits in Minnesota require you to be licensed firearm owner?

You invite friend to try duck hunting, but he does not own gun so you want to loan him your shotgun. Seems like a barrier to entry if people don't want to go through hassle of getting licensed to own a firearm.

Rick
Click to expand...

Seems to be that way. On the one hand, I see your point. On the other, even if the friend wants to try hunting for the first time, they'll still need to get a hunting license any way. That may include taking a hunter safety class in many states. I suppose getting the firearms license won't be any more difficult, provided they have a clean record, etc..

In a related story, I've been guiding a friend's teenaged son for 4 years, now. At the time of our first trip, I told the family that the boy needed to take the NC hunter safety class. It's been four years now and he still hasn't taken the class. I blame the parents for not getting this done. Bottom line, we all have to jump through hoops and if the boy (or anyone else) wants to hunt, they have to get the proper requirements.
 
Since states like to attach fees to all these regulations how much will all the new requirements cost? seems like another barrier to entry.

Rick
 
Thanks for the info on the gun law. I did have time and did look into it. The law provided above must be an older version. The actual information I have come across says I can loan a gun to a hunting partner for 12 hours, not 30 days.

Doesn't really matter though. If a CO came up to me and asked who the gun belong to I would, in a nice way, tell him without a warrant, or an arrest, I'm not saying anything (I have to work on that language for sure but the point being I am not required by law to answer such questions). Or after I calm down a little over these new laws (before the upcoming hunting season) and I was asked whose gun it was, how would he know? And if Mr. Friday's copy of the law is correct and I can loan a gun to a partner for 30 days, how in the hell would a CO know if I loaned it that morning or months ago?

I abhor stupid, unenforceable laws that makes us law abiding folks suspicious criminal.

And the law is in effect since yesterday, not 2024, And it treats shotguns differently than handguns or semi automatic pistols. Those can only be loaned out if one completes the proper background checks and paperwork.

All in the name of decreasing gun violence in MN. One, it won't as criminal don't give a rip about any gun law, and two, there has been one mass shooting (7 people) as far back as I can recall so we are talking many many years.

Such BS.
 
Joe Friday said:

Here's a link to the text of the law:

SF 1723 as introduced - 93rd Legislature (2023 - 2024) (mn.gov)

The text about loaning a firearm (waiver) says:

Sec. 16. [624.7136] FIREARM TRANSFERS; REQUIREMENTS.
Subdivision 1. Definition.
As used in this section, "transfer" has the meaning given in
section 624.712, subdivision 6, but does not include:
(1) the delivery of a firearm to a person for the purpose of repair, reconditioning, or
remodeling;
(2) a loan by a teacher to a student in a course designed to teach marksmanship or firearms
safety, in the presence of the instructor, if the course is approved by the commissioner of
public safety;
(3) a loan between persons lawfully engaged in hunting or target shooting if the loan is
intended for a period of no more than 30 days and both persons are licensed to possess
firearms;
(4) while hunting or trapping if the hunting or trapping is legal in all places where the
transferee possesses the firearm and the transferee holds a license to possess firearms and
all licenses or permits required for hunting or trapping;
(5) while in the actual presence of the transferor; provided that any transfer under this
clause is permitted only if the transferor has no reason to believe that the transferee is
prohibited by federal law from buying or possessing firearms or not entitled under state law
to possess firearms. If the transferee is under 18 years of age, it must be under direct
supervision and control of the transferor;
(6) a loan between peace officers, as defined in section 626.84; and
(7) a loan between employees or between the employer and an employee in a business
if the employee is required to carry a firearm by reason of employment and is the holder of
a valid permit to carry a pistol.

Basically you cannot "transfer" a firearm without background checks or license except under the above-listed conditions. Loaning a shotgun for hunting or shooting is okay.


I found the requirement for a license, and the requirement for liability insurance to be the more impactful piece of the legislation.


Both of these requirements go into effect January 1, 2024.
Click to expand...

I believe this was a version of another proposed law introduced in the legislature but this is not the law that was passed. I believe the law that was actually passed is SF2909. I found the law but it is an omnibus bill of several hundred pages long. And being as how the government doesn't want us to easily fin what we are looking for in any bill, there is no info at the front of the bill that says where certain new laws are located
 
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Not to be a complete wise ass, which I am, but I think you have two options:

Move

Don't worry about it


We have all kinds of laws here in NJ about firearms. One of them is that you are supposed to have a firearms permit with you at all times when you have a firearm with you, which I guess is a kind of license. I have never, ever been asked for it either by a game warden or in the sad situation where I have been pulled over for speeding on the way to go duck hunting with guns and all kinds of stuff in the car(which has happened a few times). I also don't know anyone that has been ever asked to show it unless they are buying a firearm.

Maybe it's different in Minnesota, but unless you had more guns than people in a hunting party, I find it highly unlikely that anyone would even ask. Now, if your neighbor shoots somebody with a gun they borrowed from you, and they can prove you lent it to them, you probably have an issue on your hands.

Good luck. You live in the land of milk and honey.
 
The Michigan waterfowl regulations state, "you may only use or possess one firearm per person".
For years I took two shotguns on my boat hunts, a semi-automatic and my BPS pump. Since I hunt all day, my thinking was if my semi or another's malfunctioned we would have a spare. Well Golly, I've been a law breaker. Now some enforcement officers may understand I didn't see the one word sentence, and if it wasn't loaded, it might pass the sniff test. Unfortunately, I and my hunting partners have gone through the shakedown by some overzealous officers, just looking for a reason to write us up. I'm sure there are those who in the past have kept a 2nd gun loaded for whatever their reasoning...thus the law.
I and my hunting party take great pride in following the laws. And always respectful of the CO job.
So I do not carry a 2nd gun these days.
Check your regulations.
Steve
 
greg setter said:
Not to be a complete wise ass, which I am, but I think you have two options:

Move

Don't worry about it


We have all kinds of laws here in NJ about firearms. One of them is that you are supposed to have a firearms permit with you at all times when you have a firearm with you, which I guess is a kind of license. I have never, ever been asked for it either by a game warden or in the sad situation where I have been pulled over for speeding on the way to go duck hunting with guns and all kinds of stuff in the car(which has happened a few times). I also don't know anyone that has been ever asked to show it unless they are buying a firearm.

Maybe it's different in Minnesota, but unless you had more guns than people in a hunting party, I find it highly unlikely that anyone would even ask. Now, if your neighbor shoots somebody with a gun they borrowed from you, and they can prove you lent it to them, you probably have an issue on your hands.

Good luck. You live in the land of milk and honey.
Click to expand...

I frequently have more guns in the boat than people hunting. Always carry a spare. And yeah, I'm not going to worry about as my MN hunting is a few days a year and Wisconsin hunting is significantly more.

and if I lent my gun to a neighbor and he shoots someone how are they going to prove it without the neighbor squealing?

Hate dumbass, unclear open to interpretation unenforceable laws.
 
I think your plight is living in a state that is ruled by one large metropolis. Generally leads to what you are describing.
 
greg setter said:
I think your plight is living in a state that is ruled by one large metropolis. Generally leads to what you are describing.
Click to expand...

Thank God I am formerly from that State, clown show of a Governor, never seen a tax they don't like, and trample everyone's liberty's at a moments notice. I will gladly go back and exercise my lifetime hunting, fishing, and trapping rights to just get even in what I contributed to the tax line in that State. The visual I see is that governor sitting in the toilet bowl reaching for the flipper to see if he can flush him and the State down the crapper. How fast the 612's can screw up a State is literally amazing, come down duck and pig hunting with us, no need to bring your guns we can borrow, give, lend, whatever we please in TEXAS.
 
have yhe liberal lunatics forgotten theSECOND AMENDMNT TO THE U S CONSTITUTION? Illinois pulled this yers ago and it was declared unconstitutionsl Way to go , otto koerner!
 
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