Saw this a few months back on the hunt quietly IG account....

[HenryHawthorne]

RM I think what Tod is talking about is like things I've heard from guide friends from Kodiak, Montana, and here in NC.

There are the people that come that has saved up for the once of a lifetime hunt or just to have a good time together with friends but they are hunters that know what it takes to kill an animal. But a lot of people that use guides are not hunters. They are shooters, they expect the guide to make it happen because they are paying them even if it means breaking the law or making unethical shots so they can be of some status either with their friends or on the instagram to mimic the influencers.

So I agree that guides help with conservation if they are good but I know quite a few that harm the hunt industry and the quality of hunt. Quite a few waterfowl guides around here bait ducks to either keep others from hunting an area or to just get their clients birds at all cost. That's not helping the waterfowl any form or fashion and creates problems with the hunting community.

So just because someone uses a guide, or asks for help on here to build a boat, doesn't make them a less of a hunter or craftsman. But in the guiding industry there is a huge swath of clients that are not hunters.

Fair enough.

 

[William Reinicke]

Ben

I'm not trying to disagree because I very much feel the sport is getting lopsided in favor of guide services to the detriment of avg. joe access. What are the ways they lock you or me out of the land? Now I understand laws can be passed that limit non-resident hunting and getting a guide can be a way around that, like what Manitoba does. But here in the US and other parts of Canada how can guides lock the average hunter out? Obviously they can lease land but doesn't that come down to capitalism in the form of highest bidder wins? Or are you referring to other ways and what are those?

@Eric Patterson,

it happens A LOT! Any fowl hunting around Amarillo Tx is long gone. Its impossible to free lance that area anymore. Used to, I could roll out to Tx, run around and find a feed. Knock a door and get access. It was never really an issue. Sometimes I got told no, but for the most part it wasnt hard at all. Even if it wasnt the mega feed, there were other feeds going on around that would provide limits. Everyone was hunting and there was lots of birds to be had everywhere, and lots of success. Now its all locked up under contract. Some birds still use fields but they dont get hunted because that goose feed isnt as big as the goose feed that the guides have their clients on. Yet that field is leased by the guide service and if the landowner lets other hunters on it, its a breech of contract. Lots of the landowners ive talked to or knocked on their door says "I really wish I could let you out there, but guide company x has it leased and I face penalty if I let anyone out there to hunt without them". Landowner put themselves in the predicament by signing the lease during the off season. Guides get all the land in the area to hunt, and the avg joe hunter is SOL. Ive heard landowners beyond frustrated because they have geese in their fields all season. 15 people have asked permission to hunt it that season, but they cant let them because of the contract. That guide company may never hunt that field because that feed just isnt big enough to run 10-15 guns on. Kind of a drag.

See post 62. I explain it there. Im sure its happening around the country more and more.

 

[HenryHawthorne]

Eric, it happens A LOT! Any fowl hunting around Amarillo Tx is long gone. Its impossible to free lance that area anymore. Used to, I could roll out to Tx, run around and find a feed. Knock a door and get access. It was never really an issue. Sometimes I got told no, but for the most part it wasnt hard at all. Even if it wasnt the mega feed, there were other feeds going on around that would provide limits. Everyone was hunting and there was lots of birds to be had everywhere, and lots of success. Now its all locked up under contract. Some birds still use fields but they dont get hunted because that goose feed isnt as big as the goose feed that the guides have their clients on. Yet that field is leased by the guide service and if the landowner lets other hunters on it, its a breech of contract. Lots of the landowners ive talked to or knocked on their door says "I really wish I could let you out there, but guide company x has it leased and I face penalty if I let anyone out there to hunt without them". Landowner put themselves in the predicament by signing the lease during the off season. Guides get all the land in the area to hunt, and the avg joe hunter is SOL. Ive heard landowners beyond frustrated because they have geese in their fields all season. 15 people have asked permission to hunt it that season, but they cant let them because of the contract. That guide company may never hunt that field because that feed just isnt big enough to run 10-15 guns on. Kind of a drag.

See post 62. I explain it there. Im sure its happening around the country more and more.

That woukd tick me off, too. But sounds like something that should take care of itself pretty quickly - either farmers will stop entering contracts or will negotiate guaranteed number of hunt days/week if birds are present (if not met they can offer out). Or perhaps there isnt enough guide competition out there that the bottom feeders can get away with it.

There is so much dove guide competition in S Texas the farmers really have the upper hand, from what I can tell. A guide that can't both bring consistent clients and manage the resource to maximize a long season loses their fields to another who can.

 

[William Reinicke]

That woukd tick me off, too. But sounds like something that should take care of itself pretty quickly - either farmers will stop entering contracts or will negotiate guaranteed number of hunt days/week if birds are present (if not met they can offer out). Or perhaps there isnt enough guide competition out there that the bottom feeders can get away with it.

There is so much dove guide competition in S Texas the farmers really have the upper hand, from what I can tell. A guide that can't both bring consistent clients and manage the resource to maximize a long season loses their fields to another who can.

There really is only one guide service. They entered and took over. Its been going on for the last 6-7 years. Its finally getting to the point where farmers are slowly not signing contracts, but its not resolving quick enough. But they have owned the area for quite some time.

For some odd reason, snows are only 5/day now and no conservation season. No one can figure out why. Its beyond dumb as that area holds one of the biggest wintering grounds for snows. Some have said its because of the guide presence that is there. Some say it was one bad year of migration and biologists freaked out and thought numbers were dropping. I can promise you, the numbers are back in full swing in a major way. We sat on a playa and watched thousands in and out of the decoys for a couple hours. Nothing we could do, we had our 20 on the ground already. Used to be 25/day during regular season and unlimited during conservation season. Oh the days we shot hundreds and hundreds of snows.