*UPDATE* decoy setting dilemma, strategy help needed . . .*UPDATE*

NickR

NickR

Well-known member
The place I grew up hunting is a point on a lake. The point runs East/West. We have our best chances on a North or NW wind and set dekes almost exclusively on the south side of the point. As shooting opportunities tend to be somewhat less than what we would prefer, we are generalists - if it tastes good, we'll shoot it. So, we combo up on puddler/diver/honker decoys. I always struggle with the "optimum" decoy spread for this location - hoping that someday I will find the magic spread design that will be irrestible to all delicious waterfowl.

I will be hunting there this weekend and I figure we have a reasonable chance of taking any diver species, possibly mallards, and a pretty fair chance at honkers, maybe.

The general theme of the decoy spread will be a lump of honkers/mallards, then a landing hole, then a lump of bluebills, redheads, canvasbacks, buffleheads, and goldeneyes. The wind will be N/NW, so waves should be rolling into the north side of the point, so putting decoys out in the chop north of the point seems counterintuitive to me.

Would you put the divers off the tip of the point with the honkers/mallards to the west in the fully protected waters, or vice versa? I am also thinking of running a long stringer out into the lake, although it seems the ducks tend to land out in the stringer instead of flying all the way into the gap. We try different things from time to time, but with generally meager hunting, its hard to tell if it really matters. On the other hand, when the shooting is good, we also wonder if the decoy spread really matters! Looking forward to reading any thoughts you gentlemen have to share.

Thanks,
NR
 
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I like your idea of having a few divers out past the point. It will get the attention of anything going by at least. I'd put the divers out there. I had some landing in 3'+ breaking waves out on Lake Michigan a couple weeks ago so I don't think they will mind too much. Keep the puddlers and geese in the calmer water. Just my opinion, from my experiences.
 
I've seen divers out in 3-4' seas just riding the waves, so I dont think you have to be worried about it being "too" rough. But getting anchors to hold might be a chore!

Other than that, having your divers on more visible & the geese & puddlers in the calmer areas sounds about right.
Dont try to overthink it much.
 
The way divers like to follow lines I'd try to use the edge where the rough water
and the calmer meet. Set your string along that edge to draw the divers to the main
spread. We have good luck setting up on simular situations and also use ice edges or
even on mud lines after a storm. Remember to not leave any holes in your string that
will encourage the birds to set bown early.
Let us know how it goes, John
 
This is a general set up on a point where I often hunt. I run a string up wind six or seven decoys down to the main bunch. After the main bunch a few down wind to form a U or V I put the red heads or cans on the V Most the ducks where we hunt come from up wind that why the string up wind. It seems to bring them down lower over the decoys. When ducks are landing they usually land on the V closes too the point. A point where we hunt you can not see the ducks coming from up wind. They usually go past the decoys circle and come in landing up wind. Our farthest decoys from the point are 60 feet. Puddlers up close to shore. Geese a hundred feet.

One mention when ducks want to land I don't think it matters how you place them. When they don't want to land it doesn't matter either. I have come to that conclusion after trying many different sets over the years. Yet we keep trying.
View attachment decoy placement.jpg
 
I think it was Ralf Coykendall in his book on rigging duck decoys who made some sort of statement about ducks sometimes being reluctant to cross goose decoys, but not vice-versa. If I'm mixing in geese, I try to observe that "rule" based on wind direction and place the goose decoys downwind so the ducks won't have to cross them.
 
I like Wispete's set-up.....I have used a very similar set-up under similiar situations.

Just some thought though:
1)If the point you are setup on is less than 150 yds,I'd put a few geeese directly behind me.
My thinking is if the geese come from behind you they will swing around and come into your main decoy spread in front of you

2)If the setup doesn't work after one or two refusals...change it up a little

Tom
 
I think it was Ralf Coykendall in his book on rigging duck decoys who made some sort of statement about ducks sometimes being reluctant to cross goose decoys, but not vice-versa. If I'm mixing in geese, I try to observe that "rule" based on wind direction and place the goose decoys downwind so the ducks won't have to cross them.
Click to expand...

I have been told the same thing. The old timers in NJ say that black ducks wont fly over brant .
 
Dont try to overthink it much.
Click to expand...

I totally agree with Carl...but if you want a plan, WisPete's looks pretty good, I'd add a big ass swan between the divers and puddlers ;^)

Chuck
 
Chuck,
I had a pair of swans land just outside my set last year and every duck that saw them buzzed them.
So I planed to make a couple swans for this year. I made the first one of wood and my wife claimed it.
It is so heavy I would have had to tow it behind the boat!! My new plan is a pair from black cork, maybe
next year. I still like the idea. John
 
A few weeks ago while I was hunting in the UP of Michigan I had 6 swans swim into my set up. It was the funniest thing I ever saw. They would swim up to the decoys and try and intimidate the decoys. The one in the picture below was very aggresive towards the decoys.
View attachment swans sm.JPG
But the funniest part was when they swam over to the goose decoys. The swan would get close to a decoy then back off. He did this for four or five times over a few minutes. Then he lunged forward and hit the decoy, being a plastic decoy (I know not traditional) it made a loud bang. It scared the crap out of the swans and they all pulled back at the same time startled by the noise. It was just too funny to watch. They soon swam away from my set up and never came back again.
 
Something I have used very effectively...Have shot many of birds hunting the down wind side of points in any wind condition...

View attachment Decoys Layout.jpg


Try sending one long line or even connect two swinging out 75 yards out around the point into the heavy water...Place as many divers at the end of the line closest to you between the long ling...Keep in mind the end of the long line should be 15 to 20 yards off shore...As the end of the line becomes sheltered out of the wind start blending in decoys in a mass leaving open slots...Take two more lines and make a spider web with open lanes for divers to come into to...As you get more into the sheltered area start setting out puddles and geese mixed...Have the puddlers mixed within the geese but make sure there are a group or two on the outside of the geese...

I have used this spread for many years hunting points on Kentucky and Barkley Lakes...Actually some of the long lines were bottles painted black and white...Since then they have been replaced with my own hand carved birds...Just make sure the longest lines reaches out into the big water...It is the enticer...More often then not coffee or hot chocalte is spilled on yourself as you jump to grab your gun as those divers come out of know where to land...

Good Luck...

Special K
 
I think it was Ralf Coykendall in his book on rigging duck decoys who made some sort of statement about ducks sometimes being reluctant to cross goose decoys, but not vice-versa. If I'm mixing in geese, I try to observe that "rule" based on wind direction and place the goose decoys downwind so the ducks won't have to cross them.
Click to expand...


Bob, not doubting you or Ralf, but then why have I had such success with ducks on the field flying over the geese decoys to the duck decoys behind me?

I also ususally put the geese out like in Wis Pete's diagram and have had quite a bit of success with mallards coming around?

I do just like Pete and have them more off to the side and not directly in front of the hole so maybe that is the subtle difference.

One other note, everyone says they land "with the wind only" well I can tell you on calm to slightly windy days, they usually land that way, but on really windy days, I have had them land with and cross wind more often that I want. Usually startling you since they "came from the wrong way"

Good luck either way.
 
Thanks for all the feedback!

I really like Kristan's decoy spread.

My experience has been that geese are much more finicky about how/where they land and would be less likely to come in over duck dekes. I believe its because they aren't as agile in flight as ducks.

Any other opinions / experience with geese flying over duck dekes or vice versa?

I appreciate the discussion.

NR
 
I've used goose decoys to lock up an area and keep ducks out of it. I've read Ralph Coykendalls book every summer prior to the season and tried to carry those ideas into the field. I will set my goose decoys up where I know it won't interfere with the ducks working my spread (I'm really after ducks, geese are a side-show).

I have seen ducks fly over geese and geese fly over ducks, but generally i've observed that ducks will try to not fly over geese. I have also seen that the geese need a great approach, as someone said because they aren't as agile in flight. I try to set up the goose decoys so I get nice passing shots as they fly over the ducks towards my goose decoys, which are "blocking" an area I don't want ducks to set down in.

I also am a big believer in not having many decoys farther that I can shoot. I hunted this morning with some guys I recently met and they believed in the "lock up these other places with duck decoys". We had more birds land father out that I wanted, giving us poor shots.

I would recommend Coykendalls book....and the use of a highlighter or do some underlining. It makes a refresher prior to the season a lot faster (an hour instead of a day).

I also really like the decoy spread Kristan put up.

Good luck.
 
Well, Dad and I had a decent weekend. We saw at least 10x the number of geese as ducks and that wasn't too surprising.

Figuring that the geese would be most difficult to work, we put the goose dekes and the Mallards off the east end of the point, then left a pretty big gap, and laid out 52 diver blocks on the south side of the point. We definitely had our chances at the geese and got a reasonable amount of action out of the ducks we saw.

The biggest thing I see, is that all waterfowl want to land off the tip of the point. It takes a heckuva good weather event to get the ducks to really decoy on the south side of the point, and the weather was pretty mild. Only one diver actually worked the spread and he sat between the mallards and geese. A green wing teal did the same thing. We had some spooners that would have sat had we not shot and the same with a couple flocks of geese.

Four goldeneyes came right over the point and we got two of them. I would say we really didn't see enough divers to guage whether they would work better had the divers been off the tip of the point, but I highly doubt the geese would have worked so nicely if we switched the places.

If things get really good next year, I will use Kristan's spread because I think that has a lot of value for a mixed bag situation like we have. Also, if the ducks outnumbered the geese, I would use the spread most of you guys recommended, with the divers off the end and the mallards/geese on the south side.

Thanks again for all your insight!

NR
 
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