Devlin bluebill build thread.
- Thread starter Paul W
- Start date
Pete McMiller
Well-known member
You're correct Paul, there haven't been any dimensions on any knees for either Devlin boat I have built. The closest was them hand drawn on a graph with 1" squares. There is a reason for this I believe. The first big variable in building anything is the quality and consistence of the raw material. In the case of plywood there can be differences in stiffness/springback from sheet to sheet that affects the final profile of the hull, shear and the decks. The long and short of it is, even if they were dimensioned, you would need to hand fit the knees. When I did that I missed the height of one of the knees and had to put in a sister on one of them - oh well, epoxy fixes everything 
My recommendation is to hand fit with something like thin luan or cardboard to get your angles right or make your knees over size and trim to fit.
My recommendation is to hand fit with something like thin luan or cardboard to get your angles right or make your knees over size and trim to fit.
Cody Williams
Well-known member
For the knees I usually do what the other guys have recommended and make a full size template out of particle board, get it to fit perfectly, and make the actual piece from that. I know that Devlin doesn't give dimensions but I would bet that there's enough variation from hull to hull that giving an exact size probably isn't a good idea. I'm really liking following your build, it's looking great!
Ray
Well-known member
What Pete and Cody said. I used hardboard for cutting and fitting all of my knees, and bulkheads. That way you have a template for each piece that is custom fitted before you start cutting up the good material. The knees were the last thing I fitted into the hull. Do all your full bulkheads first. I am assuming that your boat will have four knees like a BBIII. The stern knees will be slightly different in shape than the bow knees.
The plans only call for one per side, but doing two might not be a bad idea.
I am also thinking about bonding in the floor for even more side to side strength, and making an access hatch in the back to be able to sponge any water out that gets through to the bottom between the floor timbers. This is one of the few things that i saw that Eric reccomended as a change to his build in an old thread I saw in a search, and it does seem like a good idea to me, a lot of side to side strength to be gained there, and hull rigidity.
Also, what is a good source for a bow eye? Do you guys use the eyes on the pods of the back that would be seen on a larger boat? This is what I hook my straps to on my larger lund boat.
thanks for being a wealth of information. I will be fabbing the knees tomorrow night, and starting on the mudding and taping, from the front back.
I am also thinking about bonding in the floor for even more side to side strength, and making an access hatch in the back to be able to sponge any water out that gets through to the bottom between the floor timbers. This is one of the few things that i saw that Eric reccomended as a change to his build in an old thread I saw in a search, and it does seem like a good idea to me, a lot of side to side strength to be gained there, and hull rigidity.
Also, what is a good source for a bow eye? Do you guys use the eyes on the pods of the back that would be seen on a larger boat? This is what I hook my straps to on my larger lund boat.
thanks for being a wealth of information. I will be fabbing the knees tomorrow night, and starting on the mudding and taping, from the front back.
Last edited:
Pete McMiller
Well-known member
A couple of things Paul. While it might seem prudent and expedient to make the knees now, you might want to wait a bit to see how the hull and shears set up - the angles could change a bit. Get the keel filleted and then the shear to hull, let this set so you have a solid base to work with.
As far as an epoxied in floor, absolutely. Makes for a very solid platform that, for the most part, is sealed off from the elements. When I did my floor I put a limber hole thru the base of the foreward cockpit bulkhead and put a 1/4" screen over the hole (to keep empties out). Then fitted the floor and epoxied it in all around. In the stern I put an access hole with a screened cover and a hard wired bilge pump. It was my feeling that water is going to get in there no matter what and I wanted a way to manage it. I suppose you could totally seal it off by then - no ventilation. Here are a couple of pics of the aft end of my floor (BB3)
As far as hardware, West Marine, Hamilton Marine (great people), etc. have bow eyes. In the stern on the aft end of the sponsons I put brass handles and in hindsight, that was a good move as it sure helps to have something to hang onto when pushing or pulling through the mud, etc. The also work just fine for tie-down spots.
As far as number of knees, if the plans call for one then that's what I would do. The BB3s that Ray and I built call for two per side but it's a bigger boat. Stick to the plans unless you have the experience to modify the design.
As far as an epoxied in floor, absolutely. Makes for a very solid platform that, for the most part, is sealed off from the elements. When I did my floor I put a limber hole thru the base of the foreward cockpit bulkhead and put a 1/4" screen over the hole (to keep empties out). Then fitted the floor and epoxied it in all around. In the stern I put an access hole with a screened cover and a hard wired bilge pump. It was my feeling that water is going to get in there no matter what and I wanted a way to manage it. I suppose you could totally seal it off by then - no ventilation. Here are a couple of pics of the aft end of my floor (BB3)
As far as hardware, West Marine, Hamilton Marine (great people), etc. have bow eyes. In the stern on the aft end of the sponsons I put brass handles and in hindsight, that was a good move as it sure helps to have something to hang onto when pushing or pulling through the mud, etc. The also work just fine for tie-down spots.
As far as number of knees, if the plans call for one then that's what I would do. The BB3s that Ray and I built call for two per side but it's a bigger boat. Stick to the plans unless you have the experience to modify the design.
Pete McMiller
Well-known member
Paul,
Not sure what you have for previous epoxy experience but a couple of suggestions.
Enlist an experienced helper - even if you have to supply beer for afterwards. Once you get rolling, just someone to reliablly mix the next batch takes a lot of time off the project.
Mise en place - Set up everything ahead of time including cleanup stuff, garbage cans, etc. Don't have to look for stuff when you need it. Plain white vinegar is great for cleanup.
Except for laying down epoxy peanut butter, where tongue depressors, squeegees, etc. are important - use disposable brushes and rollers. The roller in this pic is from Menards and is one of the best tools I used in my last build - I won't epoxy without them again. Buy extra as they eventually sag when they get used for a long time. They are disposable.
Not sure what you have for previous epoxy experience but a couple of suggestions.
Enlist an experienced helper - even if you have to supply beer for afterwards. Once you get rolling, just someone to reliablly mix the next batch takes a lot of time off the project.
Mise en place - Set up everything ahead of time including cleanup stuff, garbage cans, etc. Don't have to look for stuff when you need it. Plain white vinegar is great for cleanup.
Except for laying down epoxy peanut butter, where tongue depressors, squeegees, etc. are important - use disposable brushes and rollers. The roller in this pic is from Menards and is one of the best tools I used in my last build - I won't epoxy without them again. Buy extra as they eventually sag when they get used for a long time. They are disposable.
Tom Scholberg
Well-known member
Pete, Thanks for the beer suggestion (wink wink). I second the roller suggestion and I also buy chip brushes by the handful. It's not that being organized will prevent mess it will just keep it to a manageable mess. I haven't had a chance to get over to see Paul's build yet but once the foot of new SNOW melts I plan on getting over there. Nothing like a new build to keep the excitement up.
Pete McMiller
Well-known member
HaHaHa - I had you in mind when I made that comment, Tom. BTW - If you like IPAs, I have been drinking a new-to-me beer the past couple of months - Lagunitas IPA. Just came into our market about 6 months ago.
Tom Scholberg
Well-known member
Pete, We just found a craft beer store here called "The Four Firkins", I have never seen so many different bottles in one spot. Will look for Lagunitas next time.
Neal Haarberg
Active member
Something like Pete has for a bildge cannot be understated. The amount of water that will get into a duckboat from getting in and out and a dog getting in and out can make for an unsafe condition on the ride home. Having a bildge to keep water out throughout the day is paramount in my opinion. I had have a boat I built similer to the devlin snow goose and my battery was dead one morning. (My kid decided to flip some switches and left them on a few day before....) It was calm when we went out but the weather came up and was nasty on the way back having the water in the boat made for a very bad ride back. Also having an opening in the floor towards the bow so that it can be flushed out at the end of the season is nice. Sand mud and all sorts of stuff will get under there. My old motor did not require a battery but the new one does. So now I have 2 batteries and can switch my lights and bildge to run from either one to add some redundancy in the system. I don't know what you plan is for mounting a switch panel but make sure it is water tight. I didn't do that my first time around and ended up having to replace 3 years later from corrosion. Lots of good advise on here that has already been stated. And whatever you do don't knock over one of those cups with leftover epoxy and a chipbrush in it and not notice!. I did that and had a brush permanently epoxied to my garage floor. Everybody who came into my garage tried to pick it up. It wasn't coming up without taking concrete with it.
Pete McMiller
Well-known member
Neal,
The first time I had my BB3 out it was in 3-4 footers on Green Bay and my bilge pump was set up with a -plug it in if I need it - system. I had to stop 4 times on the way back to the landing that day to plug in the pump and empty the boat. Within a few days I had the pump mounted and hard wired as you see it.
Regarding epoxy on the floor. I remember walking into Lee Harker's garage when he was building his BB2 and there were clumps of epoxy all over the floor. When I did mine I figured that I'd just take a chisel to them after they were dry - NOPE!, tried it on a couple and had pock mark holes in the concrete - had to grind them off. Now, when I use the stuff I try and have cardboard or paper on the floor to catch the drips.
The first time I had my BB3 out it was in 3-4 footers on Green Bay and my bilge pump was set up with a -plug it in if I need it - system. I had to stop 4 times on the way back to the landing that day to plug in the pump and empty the boat. Within a few days I had the pump mounted and hard wired as you see it.
Regarding epoxy on the floor. I remember walking into Lee Harker's garage when he was building his BB2 and there were clumps of epoxy all over the floor. When I did mine I figured that I'd just take a chisel to them after they were dry - NOPE!, tried it on a couple and had pock mark holes in the concrete - had to grind them off. Now, when I use the stuff I try and have cardboard or paper on the floor to catch the drips.
Ray
Well-known member
For your hardware you will want to use scrap 3/4 material to build in backing plates to spread the load out.
I used a two bolt bow eye since I was worried about it spinning and then not being able to tighten it back up once it was sealed in the forward floatation chamber. I installed my bow eye in the bow plate on the nose as shown in the plans for the BBIII. I do not recommend this as it resulted in trailer tie down issues later on. The trailer I bought did not allow for a wide selection of positions of the bow eye and the winch. It took several adjustments of the winch and bow support struts to figure out that the real problem was the location of the bow eye. I recommend installing it down low on the keel. That makes the boat tow cleaner on the water, and presents a better angle for the trailer winch and bow strut for trailering.
My stern handles and cleats are attached using huge bronze screws into doubled up backing plates. In each stern pod I installed a top support stringer under the deck skin just like in the bow section. At the time of my BBIII build (2003) I was pretty heavy and wanted to make sure that the front deck was over built so there is a wide center stringer for supporting the deck and attaching a cleat as called for in the plans. Then I have two narrow side stringers over the forward storage area. All my stringers are made from doubled up 3/8 scrap material left over from the hull sheets, and some are just 3/4 scrap. All hardware is sealed with 3M 5200.
Make sure you cut a drain hole in the forward storage compartment bulkhead where the joint for the keel is. My BBIII plans did not call for this and it is a huge mistake IMO. Hard to fix after the boat is built. I am always having to sponge out water from the storage area.
I used simple ABS pipe fitting floor drain caps to cover up the limber holes in the floor. It keeps most of the muck and all the shell casings out of the bilge. I used a 10 x 12 plastic deck fitting over the stern bilge access hatch. The only issue I have with my bilge is that my floor is not very tall and I can not install a bilge pump as they are all too tall to fit under the floor. I can use a small 12v well pump but I have yet to get that installed.
The center floor support was made out of scrap 3/8 material (about 6 layers just under 2" wide) laminated with epoxy and then hand fitted to the shape of the keel joint.
I installed my floor with a 1/8" gap at the stern to allow for water to quickly drain into the bilge. There is also a gap between the forward bulkhead and the floor to allow for water to enter the bilge. These gaps are mainly for winter storage to prevent water from accumulating on the floor and building up ice, but they also allow for simple drainage when trailering home.
Back in 2003 there were builders commenting on how their knees had come detached from the decks. The consensous was that the connection had too little surface area. I installed scrap 3/4 material as a doubler at the tops of each knee to increase the surface area in contact with the deck material and then made large fillets around those. The bottoms of the knees end up glass taped and filletted in, but the tops don't unless you like taping and glassing upside down.
I used a two bolt bow eye since I was worried about it spinning and then not being able to tighten it back up once it was sealed in the forward floatation chamber. I installed my bow eye in the bow plate on the nose as shown in the plans for the BBIII. I do not recommend this as it resulted in trailer tie down issues later on. The trailer I bought did not allow for a wide selection of positions of the bow eye and the winch. It took several adjustments of the winch and bow support struts to figure out that the real problem was the location of the bow eye. I recommend installing it down low on the keel. That makes the boat tow cleaner on the water, and presents a better angle for the trailer winch and bow strut for trailering.
My stern handles and cleats are attached using huge bronze screws into doubled up backing plates. In each stern pod I installed a top support stringer under the deck skin just like in the bow section. At the time of my BBIII build (2003) I was pretty heavy and wanted to make sure that the front deck was over built so there is a wide center stringer for supporting the deck and attaching a cleat as called for in the plans. Then I have two narrow side stringers over the forward storage area. All my stringers are made from doubled up 3/8 scrap material left over from the hull sheets, and some are just 3/4 scrap. All hardware is sealed with 3M 5200.
Make sure you cut a drain hole in the forward storage compartment bulkhead where the joint for the keel is. My BBIII plans did not call for this and it is a huge mistake IMO. Hard to fix after the boat is built. I am always having to sponge out water from the storage area.
I used simple ABS pipe fitting floor drain caps to cover up the limber holes in the floor. It keeps most of the muck and all the shell casings out of the bilge. I used a 10 x 12 plastic deck fitting over the stern bilge access hatch. The only issue I have with my bilge is that my floor is not very tall and I can not install a bilge pump as they are all too tall to fit under the floor. I can use a small 12v well pump but I have yet to get that installed.
The center floor support was made out of scrap 3/8 material (about 6 layers just under 2" wide) laminated with epoxy and then hand fitted to the shape of the keel joint.
I installed my floor with a 1/8" gap at the stern to allow for water to quickly drain into the bilge. There is also a gap between the forward bulkhead and the floor to allow for water to enter the bilge. These gaps are mainly for winter storage to prevent water from accumulating on the floor and building up ice, but they also allow for simple drainage when trailering home.
Back in 2003 there were builders commenting on how their knees had come detached from the decks. The consensous was that the connection had too little surface area. I installed scrap 3/4 material as a doubler at the tops of each knee to increase the surface area in contact with the deck material and then made large fillets around those. The bottoms of the knees end up glass taped and filletted in, but the tops don't unless you like taping and glassing upside down.
Tom Scholberg
Well-known member
I guess I was just lucky, when I figured out that epoxy wasn't staying put and making the floor a mess I just let it go. After all was said and done the clumps just peeled up with a bit of floor paint, easy to fix and even easier to ignore heehee. I absolutely agree on the bilge pump theory, my fishing boat has two (2), one on an auto float switch and the other on a separate battery with a waterproof switch. And sometimes I do wear suspenders with a belt when I need to.
Thanks for the info, I am planning on at least having a little hinged door there or something similar. This will not be going out in 3 footers, I have the big lund for that! This will be a bays and calmish water boat. The spot to flush the water is a good idea, maybe I can use the drain spot from the front storage to do that?